Raise flop or turn with TPGK on draw heavy board HU

bestwestern · #1 10-31-2007, 04:09 PM

Topic line says it all
Villain almost unknown.. 25/12/3 on 20 hands or so

PokerRoom 2/4 Hold'em (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is MP with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
1 fold, Hero raises, 2 folds, BB calls.

Flop: (4.50 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, BB raises,

BadBigBabar · #2 10-31-2007, 04:13 PM

3bet now

Tugg · #3 10-31-2007, 04:14 PM

raise now

Lethe · #4 10-31-2007, 04:21 PM

I really can't think of any reason not to raise this.

kbdunn · #5 10-31-2007, 04:31 PM

Villain can easily have weaker king, gutshot with spades, 9x spades, etc. Since no read Im thinking getting to a showdown is good.

Im leaning towards 3 betting this and if called lead most turns, however this can put us in a hairy spot if raised on a paint/spade turn or river without a read, despite the strong line we have taken on the flop. So I can also see just calling all the way down to get to the SD cheaply, dont have to worry about b/c against a big hand or b/f against a weaker hand, both bad without reads.

One Outer · #6 10-31-2007, 04:43 PM

threetown, stick your hand across the table palm up and say "Monies, please!"

bestwestern · #7 10-31-2007, 05:04 PM

@ Lethe
I like to call one some flops and let him lead turn and then raise him - But usually only on less draw heavy boards.
Any thoughts on this?

Anyway I chose to raise flop as you all suggested ;-)
Not a good turn - but you all agree to bet turn?

Well I did - and unfortunately he check-raised [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] So now our we're probably behind - call turn?
PokerRoom 2/4 Hold'em (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is MP with Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
1 fold, Hero raises, 2 folds, BB calls.

Flop: (4.50 SB) K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, BB raises, Hero 3-bets, BB calls.

Turn: (5.25 BB) T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets, BB raises,

bestwestern · #8 10-31-2007, 05:22 PM

@ kbdunn - c/c all the way till river seems a bit passive?

kbdunn · #9 10-31-2007, 05:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
@ kbdunn - c/c all the way till river seems a bit passive?

[/ QUOTE ]

ya, I still want to 3 bet, and my other scenario was just me overthinking the hand like a nit if when we 3 bet and get raised on certain turns what to do without a read.

EDIT: I see OP did get c/r on the turn.... oh well haha

One Outer · #10 10-31-2007, 05:38 PM

Hero calls down. I don't think there's enough out there to be scared of to not show down. Also, if you are behind his most likely hand is two pair. If he does have two pair you have anywhere from 3-8 outs anyway with a strong tilt towards the upper end of that range. And once you're on the river I think you're ahead or chopping enough to call getting 10-1 (if I'm counting the bets correctly).