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  #1  
Old 05-12-2007, 02:43 PM
Triggerle Triggerle is offline
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Default NL50 A5 makes two pair call down or take down?

The hand made me think about my approach to two-pair hands against bad players. Many of my opponents like to bet out and then keep betting unless someone raises them. They are kind of reverse calling stations. Them, as well as the calling station types will give us 2 to 3 streets of value with TP.

I might have gotten a bit results oriented during the last 4k hands as I am down an ungodly amount with 2pair. I also read in a post (by Grunch I think) that top and bottom is a very vulnerable hand that need protection. This leads me to the following question:

If a villian is going to give us value on all three streets with TP, will protecting the hand against his 3 outs not be less EV than letting him bet?

Poker Stars - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 6 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter)

SB: $27.20
<font color="black">Hero (BB): $52.70</font>
UTG: $50.55
MP: $59.20
CO: $37.05
BTN: $77.65

<font color="black">Reads: </font><font color="blue">Villian is 30/8. I saw him betting all three streets with A2o after limping in. He will fold to any raises unless he has a monster.</font>

<font color="black">Preflop:</font> Hero is dealt A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (6 Players)
UTG calls $0.50, 4 folds, Hero checks

<font color="black">Flop:</font> ($1.25) A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">Hero bets $1.00</font>, <font color="red">UTG raises to $3.00</font>, Hero calls $2.00

<font color="black">Turn:</font> ($7.25) 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">UTG bets $3.00</font>, Hero calls $3.00

<font color="black">River:</font> ($13.25) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, UTG checks

Pot Size: $13.25 ($0.60 Rake)
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  #2  
Old 05-12-2007, 02:53 PM
Harri59 Harri59 is offline
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Default Re: NL50 A5 makes two pair call down or take down?

I dont like your call on flop, why you don't reraise him for 10$? You have a monster here, and on your read, you say he will never fold his TP..
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  #3  
Old 05-12-2007, 02:55 PM
spalding spalding is offline
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Default Re: NL50 A5 makes two pair call down or take down?

Easy 3 bet on the flop. You're way ahead of his range and there are draws out so get some money in
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  #4  
Old 05-12-2007, 03:05 PM
Triggerle Triggerle is offline
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Default Re: NL50 A5 makes two pair call down or take down?

Maybe I should give some more insight into my thinking next time. Like, maybe, an introdictory couple of paragraphs before the hand. Oh, wait, I did! [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

(No offense intended)
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  #5  
Old 05-12-2007, 03:25 PM
Knut Knut is offline
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Default Re: NL50 A5 makes two pair call down or take down?

Will villain fold to a turn bet?
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  #6  
Old 05-12-2007, 03:31 PM
Triggerle Triggerle is offline
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Default Re: NL50 A5 makes two pair call down or take down?

My reads are not that impeccable and I'm not sure. He will definitely fold to any raise (unless he has more than TP).

My question is more general, though. It's in italics right before the hand.
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  #7  
Old 05-12-2007, 03:36 PM
Knut Knut is offline
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Default Re: NL50 A5 makes two pair call down or take down?

Villain actually has more than 3 outs: 6 outs from flop to turn, 9 outs from turn to river.
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  #8  
Old 05-12-2007, 04:35 PM
Genz Genz is offline
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Default Re: NL50 A5 makes two pair call down or take down?

because the board is pretty dry, I like it. I think I bet the river here small because I don't want to give up value. The river card isn't pretty, but it's unlikely that he did all this with the 98 for the runner runner i don't know what straight. What you really fear with top and bottom pair is the board pairing in the middle, counterfeiting your hand. But you probably head for a split very often then. I think this is a board to extract.
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  #9  
Old 05-12-2007, 04:45 PM
Genz Genz is offline
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Default Re: NL50 A5 makes two pair call down or take down?

Question: what do you do if villain pushes on the river? what if it is pot size or smaller? What if it is an overbet?
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  #10  
Old 05-12-2007, 10:19 PM
Triggerle Triggerle is offline
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Default Re: NL50 A5 makes two pair call down or take down?

If he pushes I have to fold unless I have reads that he does this with TP. This is the downside of this type of line. The other downside is if he has A7o. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]
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