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My ultimate goal is not to sink the company. I want them to pay for their mistakes. I also want them to be a good company going forward.

Am I off base here?

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I'm not privy to the info you have but I don't have this kind of forgiveness. I've heard too many stories to every trust these guys again.

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What I don't get is why anyone would WANT to trust them again? This just seems a bit naive to me. Are people sitting behind their computers actually hoping against hope there is a plausible explanation for how and why they were cheated and ripped off? "Please, Absolute Poker, please tell me you haven't been cheating me all this time when I had such trust in your company!"

COME ON PEOPLE! We WERE naive! My husband has been telling me for months these people are sitting down there in Costa Rica or where ever the hell they are seeing our hole cards cheating in these tournaments and winning the big prizes. I told him he was nuts!

Why? Because I told him they wouldn't risk the ruin of their company because eventually someone would get wind of it and it would be ALL OVER the 2+2 forums. They would never get away with it. That would be the end of the company. He just told me I was very naive.

Well, he was right and I was naive, but 2+2 DID get wind of it and it is all over the forums now, and this is the best we can do!? The evidence everyone has already gotten isn't enough? We want to HELP the cheaters and thieves to go forward and become a better company? Let's kiss and make up? WTF?

If you found your girlfriend in bed with another guy would you be fishing around for explanations? Would you be naive enough to hope against hope there was some plausible explanation? Would you want to help her become a better girlfriend in the future?

Does everyone so not want to believe that they were naive enough to be cheated and stolen from by a company they trusted, that getting money returned and helping the company become a better company is more important than accepting the fact that WE'VE ALL BEEN HAD by Absolute Poker and we should be helping to bring the company down!!!

THIS SUCKS!

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Good points, Jan. Here's a counter-argument:

- We, here on this forum, won't decide whether Absolute survives or not. The marketplace will, and although I really like [the community made up of the posters to] 2+2, I have no illusions that we have some sort of huge market power. We can change some people's minds, and that's it.

- If there's one thing this thread has demonstrated, people's ethical positions vary widely. Some will never play at Absolute again. Some are still playing there. Many, I think, are on the fence, waiting to see what happens.

- It is reasonable to try to judge what kind of company Absolute will be moving forward, and to communicate that information widely. It is then up to *each individual player* to make an ethical decision about whether to play there. Those who have already decided "NO!" may see such an effort as an ethical violation, and try to prevent it, because they see the chance that such a visit may help a site that they think should be burned down. Fine, but please respect the fact that others may not agree with your position.

- If you believe Absolute is going to survive, and they convince you that they are serious about cleaning up their act, a forgiving person might be willing to give them some advice on how to proceed.

There are gray areas here obviously, but the point I keep coming back to it that a site visit is a chance to get information, and I happen to believe more information is usually better.

I understand and respect the *burn them down because they suck" argument. But the point has been made many times already.

So, getting back on topic... IF Nat and/or others go on a site visit, what questions should they ask?