Re: Tanenbaum or Stox?
Hello everyone. This is Terry Borer, one of the authors of Limit Hold'em: winning short-handed strategies.
First of all, thanks very much for the overall positive reviews. We worked really hard on the book and it is gratifying to hear that others like your work. Having read (but not posted) on twoplustwo for a while, I think this is a good thread for me to chime in on.
First of all, I don't think it matters which book is "better". While there is common material I believe they are overall different books and both will be useful to a short-handed player. I enjoyed the Stox book and would recommend it to others. I like the healthy debate that takes place in twoplustwo as well.
Second, I'd like to clarify my position on the points Yertle mentioned:
[ QUOTE ]
I read the D&B book and am an experienced short-handed limit player. I would definitely recommend it to anyone who is serious about short-handed play but I do feel there are some errors in their recommendations. Examples include - limping from the SB when you are first to act, playing a tighter range from the SB than from the button when first to act and over-valuing off-suit broadway hands in early position (KTo, QTo etc.)
[/ QUOTE ]
#1: From the SB we recommend "First-in raise or fold unless you opponent is passive" (pg83). I stand by this. Most of the time it is raise or fold, but passive players give you additional opportunities to make money by exploiting their mistakes. An extreme example is when you are first in from the SB ($2 blind) and the BB ($3 blind) never raises pre-flop. I believe limping in on weak hands is correct here since I'll see a cheap flop.
#2: Should you be tighter from the SB first in, or is it that same (or looser) as from the button? Yertle, I agree our chart is too tight, especially for good players. I think the Stox book is too loose (he says this as well) and so a more optimal number is in the middle but much closer to the Stox side. Looking back at my last 100k hands my stats look a lot like the middle player in Stox's book.
#3: Playing KTo and QTo from early position. We say to steal with this hands from UTG + 1 only and KTo as an expert hand from UTG (six-handed game). I like this play and make money with it. I think it also "balances my range" meaning my opponent is less able to put me on a hand when I sometimes raise with those cards. I sure win a lot of Axx flops. Please note that the players in the Stox book do not play those hands often so the charts say little about them. That doesn't mean they are unprofitable but I agree they are borderline.
In any event, our book is about teaching how to synthesize information together and the charts are just starting points. Excellent play is situational play. I hope our book teaches what information to look for and how to put it together.
If you would like to ask me a question I would be happy to answer. Putting my name in (or Tanenbaum's) would help me a lot in finding the thread.
Thanks,
Terry Borer
LHE: winning short-handed strategies
|