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Old 04-02-2006, 03:23 AM
sweetjazz sweetjazz is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: New Orleans
Posts: 3,700
Default Re: Why is there more River Raising at Higher Limit 6max???

Good post! Hope to see more posts from you around here.

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1. There are fewer passive players at higher limits, and this = more river aggression (or perhaps more “correct” river aggression )

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This probably is a slight factor, but it doesn't really explain what's going on.

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2. Players at higher levels (on average) have better hand and board reading skills, and are therefore able to assess with a greater level of confidence where they “are” relative to their opponents. As such, they are less shy about value raising than lesser skilled players who, through uncertainty, may choose to “call down” more often as opposed to raising the river.

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Yes sometimes a player gets a better idea of where he stands by putting together the pieces of what has happened so far in the hand. In particular, he may suspect the most likely holding for an opponent is a worse hand that will pay off a raise.

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3. Players at higher levels have (on average) better and deeper post flop skills. While some weaker players may make moves on the flop that will enable a certain turn play, they may not be able to plan or think how such plays impact the river play. On the flipside, stronger players at higher limits have more complex strategies that are more likely to set the table for river raises. (I perhaps didn’t articulate this well, but I’m thinking the better players are move prone to be thinking about the river with their flop action, while weaker players may just be thinking about the turn).

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This is definitely a big factor. Sometimes you want to keep an opponent in and not try to get value out of your hand until the pot is bloated where he is more likely to look you up.

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4. This one may seem like a paradox, but I think the extra river raising at higher limits creates opportunities for more river bluffs. It seems that at 5/10 and 10/20 players will call down river raises more often than in higher limits, and this would suggest that river bluffs would occur less frequently at lower limits. However, if the river raise action becomes more frequent in higher limits for some of the reasons noted above, would this not also allow room for more bluffs (more opportunities to find favorable situations to bluff)? If so, oddly enough, this would cause the frequency of river raises to go even higher. Or, am I missing it here and the fact is there is less river raise bluffing at higher limits?

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All my comments are based on only having played up to 20/40. At these limits, there is still a lot of river calling, so I haven't really added profitable river bluffs into my repertoire. The hard thing about river bluffs is that they might be very profitable in the right spot (maybe it works once every 5 times getting 12 to 1 to try it), but you don't want to be finding yourself too often in these spots. The point is that you are trying to get to the river with the best hand, at least most of the time. It is not generally profitable in limit HE to make elaborate multistreet plays to set up a bluff. If you are consistently getting paid off on your good hands, then you don't need to add bluffs. But as players start to make more folds, you need to add a few more bluffs to either steal some pots or force them to revert to paying you off when you value bet.
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