[Mr. Ratface]

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All Two Plus Two did, was to provide the infrastructure and also the atmosphere for a group of posters of Two Plus Two to notice, investigate and alert.


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This is flat out wrong. What Two Plus Two has done over the past twenty years is to create an entity that must be taken seriously by everyone in the poker business. Also, we do have a very strong reputation for integrity. It is this framework which allows our posters to have the kind of influence they had in this situation. No other major entity in the industry, as far as I know, was able to step forward in the manner that we did and apply the kind of pressure that we did. Yes, you may argue that this was done by our posters and not by us. But it was done under our name which meant it needed to be taken very seriously and could not be sloughed off.


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I should probably just let this go, because, after all, we're all on the same side here. But this last paragraph is really kind of silly and I don't feel like it can just let it slide. Yes, Two Plus Two, the company has integrity and credibility. But, no, that doesn't mean that all posters here get the benefit of that reputation. That's like saying that all the spam on the Yahoo finance message boards carries the credibility of Yahoo. Two Plus Two, the company, isn't responsible for the content - good or bad - posted on the forums, and likewise cannot receive credit or blame for that content.

As the person Mason was responding to said, Two Plus Two, the company, provided the infrastructure that helped support the community members who teamed up to uncover this business. That's non-trivial and you can legimately be proud of that role. But let's not carried away and suggest that Two Plus Two, the company, had a significantly bigger role than that.

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I think you're mistaken. The AP thing was discussed all over the place, not just on 2+2. It was the reputation and the high standing in the poker community of this forum that amplified the discussion and made it too loud to ignore. Had it all taken place on rgp, for example, the effect would not have been the same.

Pocket5s, to a much lesser extent, deserves some of the same credit. Without these forums, Nat and Adanthar and company would have been whining on some Yahoo feedback page and no one would have heard.

Definitely, Nat and the others did all the brainstorming, but without two other things it probably would have all been for nothing: 1. the street cred 2+2 has built up in the poker community over the years, and 2. the raw xls file that proved to be the smoking gun. I think if any one of these three ingredients had been missing, AP would have had a good chance of getting away with everything.

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He says:

As the person Mason was responding to said, Two Plus Two, the company, provided the infrastructure that helped support the community members who teamed up to uncover this business. That's non-trivial and you can legimately be proud of that role.


And you respond:

Definitely, Nat and the others did all the brainstorming, but without two other things it probably would have all been for nothing: 1. the street cred 2+2 has built up in the poker community over the years, and 2. the raw xls file that proved to be the smoking gun. I think if any one of these three ingredients had been missing, AP would have had a good chance of getting away with everything.


You are basically saying that the fact that the AP discussions were able to take place on a reputable board helped the cause, which is true, but apart from 2p2 indirectly giving credibility to the discussions here, they have not done much else, atleast publicly.

He says they provide the infrastructure to post and you argue that the provide the credibility of the forums. I see them as both the same.