[WarDekar]

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I'm not looking for value here, I am looking to see a free showdown on the river.

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What hand does villain have that beats you that he would also let you get to showdown with without stacking off? It's never happening. Your goal in this hand should not be getting to showdown without putting chips in the middle if you are behind, it should be making sure that villain stacks off when you are ahead.

Well, unless you're trusting your ninja river read and folding the nut flush, I guess.

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Exactly, there are times where you just have to accept that if you're behind you're stacking off and your only concern should be how to get other hands you beat to stack off to you.

This is something I've worked on recently and I think it's helped me a lot, sometimes you look like a douche but you jsut have to accept that it'll happen sometimes and the other times you get to make them look like a douche.

Also the cut-off point for what hand that is depends on a lot of things like opponent, buy-in, situation, etc.