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I GUESS think this is barely worth playing preflop, but why did you limp 3 bet it? How is that not awful?
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you don't think 97s wins more than 17% of the time 6handed? 20% of the time 5handed? someone needs to do some stoving!
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I gave the limpers 23% of hands excluding their raising hands from their VPIP and trimming a tiny bit of other stuff because they are in EP.
I gave the BB a 40ish % defense range. Basically any 2 suited, and pair excluding the higher pairs, and some other connecty stuff. I gave the sb the same.
I think the SB's range was prob actually tighter than that though, so I was prob being overly generous to you. I also gave the button raiser a wider range than you mentioned. This is the 6 handed calc, and you can see you are below equity.
Even if you were slightly above equity, the 3 bet would still be bad though, because you are forcing yourself to play badly after the flop and lose money. Like whenever you flop a pair you have to see the river. Whenever you flop a gutshot you have to stay in even for like 3 cold if you also have backdoor spades. This isn't good news for you. Basically, you are creating a situation where you and the fish would play exactly the same postflop, i.e. you have less of a postflop edge, according to the principal of
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Reciprocality
Double edit: basically, you are turning a decent speculative hand into one that will lose money after the flop in a lot of situations, i.e. you will put money in with negative postflop equity. So you managed to take an implied odds hand and give it reverse implied odds qualities. HER NAME IS
RIO AND SHE DANCES ON THE SAND, HER NAME IS RIO AND YOU JUST BUTCHERED YOUR HAND
GG bro
Text results appended to pokerstove.txt
4,912,085 games 225.297 secs 21,802 games/sec
Board:
Dead:
equity win tie pots won pots tied
Hand 0: 15.094% 14.33% 00.77% 703882 37967.83 { 9s7s }
Hand 1: 27.537% 26.73% 00.83% 1312798 40586.92 { 99+, ATs+, KJs+, AJo+, KQo }
Hand 2: 14.268% 13.33% 00.95% 654607 46622.17 { 66-22, A6s-A2s, KTs-K6s, Q8s+, J7s+, T7s+, 96s+, 86s+, 75s+, 64s+, 54s, A9o-A6o, KQo, KTo-K9o, QTo-Q9o, J8o+, T9o }
Hand 3: 14.280% 13.34% 00.95% 655278 46562.50 { 66-22, A6s-A2s, KTs-K6s, Q8s+, J7s+, T7s+, 96s+, 86s+, 75s+, 64s+, 54s, A9o-A6o, KQo, KTo-K9o, QTo-Q9o, J8o+, T9o }
Hand 4: 14.426% 13.54% 00.89% 665316 43708.58 { 88-22, AQs-A2s, K2s+, Q2s+, J2s+, T2s+, 92s+, 82s+, 72s+, 62s+, 52s+, 42s+, 32s, AQo-A7o, K9o+, Q9o+, J8o+, T8o+, 98o, 87o }
Hand 5: 14.394% 13.52% 00.89% 663934 43510.00 { 88-22, AQs-A2s, K2s+, Q2s+, J2s+, T2s+, 92s+, 82s+, 72s+, 62s+, 52s+, 42s+, 32s, AQo-A7o, K9o+, Q9o+, J8o+, T8o+, 98o, 87o }
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GREAT BALLS OF SNOW! you're busting out Tommy Angelo on me. damn. i can't compete with that. log me out mama, i'm comin' home with my tail between my legs.
i posted this from memory at work. i've screwed something up because last night i stoved it afterwards and showed like 23% 5handed and 20% 6handed. for that reason i think i've missposted some stats on players. the ranges must be wider than we've assigned or i would have never done this.
fwiw, last night i assigned a random hand to the first UTG limper(horrible ATC player), top 40% less premium holdings for the second limper, i gave the button's range earlier, around top 30% for sb and top 50% for the bb(less the prem. hands obv). as i said, in my OP i've screwed something up.
i do agree with your comments about postflop. generally speaking this certainly levels the playing field and helps the bad players avoid the mistakes from which we profit. but specifically speaking, when the pot's going to be large anyway(as it is here), this effect is somewhat mitigated because they're calling correctly regardless. what's do i care if they're getting 12-1 or 24-1? also, i'm chasing anyway as well. so what does that leave? table image 101. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]