[Frond]

The rake effect is a given I just failed to mention it. Known and noted. Great points & thanks for mentioning it Ben.

I have talked to a few more experienced players about stealing at low limits and it is agreed that with the rake it is not worth it. But that said, for those of us who have aspirations of moving up in limits, I think at least doing it a little bit here and there doesn't hurt(with proper cards as obv) and it will hopefully prepare us for higher limits. Though at 4/8 and 8/16 live where I play it is standard to chop the blinds when it is folded to the button on most occasions. The other players who have folded always say "chop it, chop it" when it is folded to you on the button or even in the CO at times. I don't feel like I am forced to but more often than not I fold a lot of hands on the BTn when it is folded to me at these live low limits. The blinds almost always chop at this point when it is folded to them as you all know. It keeps the table happy as well which can go a long ways. I just want to keep the stealing option alive at least in my mind in these situations and to at least think about it.

I have the Stox book but I haven't opened it yet as I am still studying, posting, playing,reading and rereading a bit more basic LLHE stuff still(as you can tell).

Amusing side note: Last night at my live 8/16 game this guy looks at his cards on the button when it is folded to him, I see he has QQ and he just limps first in on the Button. Blinds in, he bets his hand all the way only to lose on the river when a King falls off to give the BB's 2 pair. So what should he have done there? Just raised and taken the blinds minus the rake? He should have right? He was thinking "small pot but I have to play this hand" and it ended up costing him nearly $48 instead of just winning the $8(that is IF both Blinds fold to his PF raise).

PS PS: Might be interesting to have a seperate thread discussion on when it may be approriate to raise more hands in EP. I know, on the surface this sounds idiotic cause we are OOP, with the the rest of the table left to act. Reason why I mention this is because of the times when I am at a table with a very solid image and not out of line at all. Whenver I raise 1st or 2nd in almost the whole table folds to me, especially if I am able to show down big hands and big pairs close together. So when this happens I try and take advantage of it. Merely taking advantage of my perceived table image at the time. Pot Stealing OOP? Sounds like a drug habit.

(The preceding OOP raising more may really be lame but any thoughts are welcome and I wonder if anyone ever considers this when they have a really solid table image)