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I guess I was a little short so I'll expand. Many hitters have been quoted as saying Carmona has the nastiest stuff in the league. I'm not going to go that far (although the hitters' opinions should be the only ones that matter), but V Martinez said Carmona could get by by throwing his sinking fastball >90% of the time. I've watched nearly every start of his this year, there's no doubt that his sinking fastball that can get mid 90's yet have so much sinking action is one of the best three in the league.
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A lot of that is obvious hyperbole. Simply saying that some hitters said it was the nastiest stuff in the league or that Carmona's catcher pumped him up by saying he could get by as a starter only throwing his sinker doesn't really mean much. Remember, Beef said that Carmona had the best stuff since '99 Pedro, and I lol'ed at that. That is what I was debating, and saying that someone has "some of the nastiest stuff in the league" shows that he is AMONG the best stuff in the league right now. Even if I were to concede that, then you'd still have to put him up against all the lights-out pitchers from the past 8 years.
Besides, a lot of pitchers have had an 80 pitch before, but you don't just go throwing around the best stuff label without something to back it up other than a couple players' off hand quotes, including his own catcher. Mo Rivera DOES get by throwing only a fastball, so should you not concede that his fastball is better than Carmona's?
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I specifically remember Torri Hunter saying that no right hander had a chance against Carmona.
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After Game 2 of the ALDS, Ryan Garko said that he noticed all season long that when players would reach first, they would talk about how they hated facing Carmona (i can't find the exact quote, it's somewhere close to the quote where Garko says he played in the DR with Carmona last year and the bugs down there would eat you alive, so there's no reason Carmona would be bothered by the bugs in Game 2).
As far as Carmona having the best stuff since '99 Pedro or having the best stuff in the league, it looks like I can do some random stat searches at work. HOORAY!
-AA
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You can find stats regarding how good someone's raw stuff is? Fausto= nasty, but is his overall stuff package better than Peavy's? What about Beckett, Verlander,Santana from a couple years ago, Felix Hernandez, Mo Rivera, hell even Chamberlain, etc,etc? I'd say probably not, but maybe he just needs a couple years,and I need to see more of him.
But do you realize that you guys have mentioned what Hunter has said about 3 different times as if repeating it would convince me? I'd be more interested in hearing the thoughts from scouts around the league rather than Torri Hunter, Ryan Garko, and Victor Martinez.