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Old 07-29-2007, 04:51 PM
Pov Pov is offline
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Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,026
Default Re: Who gets the KITN?

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Player A keeps the money,
1) Player B stated an amount 265, not All-in, which player A called. Just because A made a mistake, or lied about having money left over doesn't exempt B from verifying. Trust but verify.

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Yeah, I gotta go with Fizz and Bull on this one. A specific amount was bet and called. That's that. One player incorrectly saying "that puts me all in" doesn't count as an automatic one-sided can-only-lose bet of anything he has left. It sucks, and it may be an angle, and if it happens ever again someone should invite him to play somewhere else for a year. But it could be an honest error. I don't see how else to handle it.

Maybe the dealer shoulda verified the statement. Not sure that's REALLY up to the dealer to one-sidedly take on, though. In high limit games, a dealer sticking his nose in to verify the statement that his call put him all in would result in things being thrown at the dealer. It's pretty much up to the other player to initiate a river bet... just say the words "all-in" and force the other guy to say call, or ask for a verification of stack sizes, or whatever.

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Giving Player A the benefit of the doubt as to whether or not he knew he wasn't truly all-in, I think I give the KITN to the procedures of the room on this one or the dealer if he/she didn't follow them. At least where I play, it is standard practice for the players to have to move their chips forward "for the cameras" before the remaining cards are dealt out. The dealer doesn't necessarily count them down and hold up the game, but that extra 5 seconds gets spent to make it clear beyond argument both Player A and Player B intend to wager all the money in front of them. At this point it should be fairly obvious Player A has more than stated. I've seen it prevent/shorten several arguments that probably save much more time in the long run than this extra few seconds, not to mention it makes the game seem more "fair". I think the most detrimental effect of table arguments is on the new players who are turned off to the game when they feel like someone got screwed, whether the rules were applied correctly or not.
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