[andyfox]

Good discussion. It does seem to me that, though it's a preflop debate, it's important, given that it's shorthanded and DD, in theory, tends towards mania and Joe, in theory, tends towards nitdom.

So it comes down to a tradeoff between the fact that, as Gabe points out, it would be better (or, should I say, less worse?) for Joe to cap here than it would be for DD in the same spot, and the fact that Joe has a crappy hand that could be tough to play with DD in between him and the "fish." My guess is that the guy ain't quite as fishy as Joe thinks, given, as Clark points out, that he's playing 4-handed here.

For you guys advocating calling or capping, are there any hands, in this situation, that you would raise with on the button and not continue on with when sb 3-bets and DD 4-bets? or that Joe should raise with on the button and not continue on?