[xlledx]

If Ive miss read this hand, then by all means chastise me, but I think I know where youre logic errors.

Put yourself in the SB's position (and plz stop refering to him as BB, its confusing). He simply calls a raise preflop with JJ, therefore his line of thinking was similar to yours preflop. Youre both suspicious of this MP charactor.

The board comes out 788, no flush. He checks to the raiser, and you bet out. Would you have called preflop with an 8 in your hand? Probably, J8,T8,98,78,and 86 are all decent calls 7.5-1 calls in a 6-way pot. There are 34 ways for you to have an 8. But, when you lead out, and you put suspicions in his mind. Most players would check trips to a preflop raiser, especially one who, as you and the SB have assumed, has a strong hand like KK or AA. I wouldnt, but most would.

Pot is $125.


The MP folds. The SB sighs a sign of relief, because he no longer has to worry about an over pair. You or the button would have reraised preflop with AA, KK, and probably QQ (the button especially).

Then the button pushes allin for $125. This is gives SB something to think about. The raise "represents" an 8, but does it really? The only thing an 8 is really afraid of at this point is the straight draw, but if the SB had a straight draw, hed be getting 2-1 anyway. 2.6 if the BB called behind him. If the BB had the straight draw, then hed obviously call the extra $75, gettig 3.3-1 if the SB folds, and 5-1 if the SB calls. In other words, the button cant be hoping to knock out a straight draw with his raise, so he has no purpose to raise here if he had an 8. He may not have an 8, but he obviously had a real hand. A bluff is just too unlikely, given the odds the BB is being laid to call. What hand fits the description of just cold call preflop, and a raise after a 788 board? A pocket pair that is vulnerable to overcards. As i said before, the Button would have probably raised preflop with QQs or better, so something like JJ-99 is the most likely. Obviously, the SB has JJ, so he feels that theyre good vs the Button.

Pot is $375.

You call the $75, and push another $300. This probably suprises the SB. But, he just doesnt believe that youd play an 8 that quickly. If you were a loose player, than yea maybe. Loose players can afford to play their strong hands fast. Tight players on the other hand, tend to play them slower to get them paid off. Youve been folding for hours, so obviously you would want your 8 to pay you off. Why the fast play then? Why the $300 raise? It doesnt protect vs a straight draw. The SB is getting 2.5 - 1, an easy enough call with a straight draw. Sure the board is paired, but almost no one would play a boat that fast. Therefore youre raise doesnt look like an 8 because it doesnt protect your hand, or massage the pot, it simply looks like a big intimidating raise. He must have put you on the a similiar hand as the Button, but hes worried about the odds of BOTH of you having overpairs that are beneath Jacks. But of course, youre preflop play basically omits the possiblity of QQs or better, and youre postflop play does little to represent an 8.

He makes a terrific read.

If I were you, I wouldnt play at this guys table. I had to in a comfortable enviroment for a few minutes to come up with the above rationalization, knowing what the cards everyone had was. The SB was able to come up with the same solution at the card table without the luxury of hindsight.

Hes good, too good. Leave him alone.