Re: Tom Brady Best QB Ever!!!!!!
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Second, you say that winning champiopships is the most important measure of a QB's success, and by that measure I could see how you might say Brady is the best ever. But why? Football isn't an individual sport. It's not even a team sport like basketball, in which one great player can carry a merely competent supporting cast to a title. The QB, though the most important player on the field, is still just one of 22 starters, he doesn't play special teams, and he's not part of the huge coaching and training staffs that NFL teams employ.
In fact, even saying that he's just one out of 22 understates the number of contributors. Teams need production from the aforementioned special teams, from specialists like slot WRs, blocking TEs, pass-rushing DEs, and nickel and dime DBs. And, this being football, they always need plenty of qualified injury replacements.
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VarlosZ, I agree with a lot of what you said. But I do think that quarterback is the one position in football that can change an entire team. Like you said, its not like basketball where one superstar can completely carry a team, but it stil is significant imo. And the thing is that I really don't believe that Brady's cast has been any better than Manning's. Certainly you'd agree that Brady has had nowhere near the weapons on offense that Manning had, no?
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So, yes, Manning and the Colts have not had a lot of postseason success. But how much of that is Peyton Manning's fault, and how much has to do with the fact that they've faced some excellent teams in the postseason (being knocked out by the eventual champ three years in a row)? How much of it has to do with the fact that the Colts' defense only last year reached the status of "above-average"?
It's hard to say, but we do have a boatload of statistics that can help us sort through these questions, and every one of them says that Peyton Manning has been superb, even in the postseason. Brady's statistics suggest that he's been a somewhat less superb player on somewhat superior teams.
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You ask me how much of that was Manning's fault? Well lets take a look at how hes done in their playoff losses:
In 1999, the Colts were one of the best teams in the league. They went 13-3 and had a first round bye. They lost their very first playoff game, which was at home. Manning went up against a Titans team that was 15th in points allowed and 18th in yards allowed, and he could only lead his well rested team to 16 points. I searched but I couldn't seem to find his stats for that game.
In 2000, the Colts opened up the playoffs on the road against Miami. Miami had a good defense: #3 in points allowed/#6 in yards allowed. Peyton led his team to 17 points in a game that included an overtime session(and the Colts did get a possession and a chance to win in OT). Manning had less than 200 yards passing and only one TD pass.
In 2002, the Colts faced the Jets in the first round. The Jets were #14 in points allowed and #24 in yards allowed. Manning led the Colts to ZERO points. Manning finished with just 137 yards and 2 INTs.
In 2003, the Colts made it to the AFC Championship before losing to the Pats. The Colts managed 14 points that game. Again, I wasn't able to find Peyton's numbers for this game, but I wouldn't think they would be too great with only 14 points.
In 2004, they again lost to the Pats. They scored 3 points. Enough said.
And then you remember last year how they lost in their first playoff game at home against the #6 seed Steelers. They scored 18 points and Manning played very poorly imo.
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I don't know, maybe you can just see something in these QBs' performances that I can't, but both the numbers and my eyes tell me that if you replaced Tom Brady on the Pats with Peyton Manning, or Daunte Culpepper, or maybe even Trent Green, the Pats probably would have had a similar level of success over the past five years, while Brady probably would have been unable to carry those players' teams to championships.
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Yes, I most definitely see something that you can't: Clutchness. Brady is clutch. Manning is not. You want some statistical proof? Here are Brady's overtime stats:
20 out of 24 passes completed. 130.2 QB rating. NO interceptions of fubmles lost. Perfect 6-0 record.
Or just go watch some of his game winning drives and you'll see how flawless he is in the clutch. Thats what you're not seeing.
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