Tough river spot, $200 NL
 

Villain is Pennpal, 20/16/3 over about 300 hands. I know he is capable of playing big pairs fairly slowly in 3 bet pots. Is my river bet really bad? Easy fold on river?

Poker Stars
No Limit Holdem Ring game
Blinds: $1/$2
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $216.10
UTG+1: $204.70
Hero: $199
Button: $243
SB: $265.45
BB: $67

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is CO with T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
2 folds, <font color="#cc0000">Hero raises to $7</font>, Button folds, <font color="#cc0000">SB raises to $24</font>, BB folds, Hero calls.

Flop: 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($50, 2 players)
<font color="#cc0000">SB bets $34</font>, Hero calls.

Turn: 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($118, 2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks.

River: 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($118, 2 players)
SB checks, <font color="#cc0000">Hero bets $65</font>, <font color="#cc0000">SB raises all-in $207.45</font>, Hero folds.
Uncalled bets: $142.45 returned to SB.

Results:
Final pot: $248

Re: Tough river spot, $200 NL
 

I check the river always. this is a really thin value bet, the only worse hands that call are 88 and 99. maybe he tries to make a hero call w/AK, but I wouldnt' count on it.

as played, pennpal is a very good player I hear, so this could easily be a move. I have never played w/him though, this might be closer than it looks.

Re: Tough river spot, $200 NL
 

I don't know this guy, but i guess he isn't very likely to check the river with QQ+, yes? He should assume you check behind every hand with some SD value. So I'm probably calling this just because it's very obvious your hand can't stand a raise.
But i don't see any value in betting this river at all.

Re: Tough river spot, $200 NL
 

I bet the river bc I though his range was mainly ace high, smaller pairs with the slight chance of an overpair. I really didnt think the river check raise could be a bluff bc the stack sizes are such that it would be difficult for me to fold anything at that point. I agree the river bet was likely way too thin.

edit: the only reason this could possibly be a bluff is b/c a river check raise is probably the only way he can win the pot with air. I'm clearly calling a river bet if he just leads.

Re: Tough river spot, $200 NL
 

check down river as played call.

Re: Tough river spot, $200 NL
 

if i bet this river im planning to call a raise

Re: Tough river spot, $200 NL
 

I check this river nearly always);

he will folds all the hands that you beat and call with what beats you. No?

as played I fold:/ I think this is rarely a bluff):

Re: Tough river spot, $200 NL
 

[ QUOTE ]
I check this river nearly always);

he will folds all the hands that you beat and call with what beats you. No?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not so sure about that. I think he calls with 88/99 any jack, and maybe ace high. I also feel he rarely has an overpair in this spot. Not saying saying betting is better than checking, but I do think he calls with hands that I beat. If he looks me up with something like AK,88,99,AJ/KJ then I'm slighly ahead of his range. If he shows up here with some unusally strong hands in this manner such as sets and QQ+ then checking is best. I'm just not sure if he ever has any of these hands after getting to the river like this.

Re: Tough river spot, $200 NL
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I check this river nearly always);

he will folds all the hands that you beat and call with what beats you. No?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not so sure about that. I think he calls with 88/99 any jack, and maybe ace high. I also feel he rarely has an overpair in this spot. Not saying saying betting is better than checking, but I do think he calls with hands that I beat. If he looks me up with something like AK,88,99,AJ/KJ then I'm slighly ahead of his range. If he shows up here with some unusally strong hands in this manner such as sets and QQ+ then checking is best. I'm just not sure if he ever has any of these hands after getting to the river like this.

[/ QUOTE ]

Then call the raise.

Re: Tough river spot, $200 NL
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I check this river nearly always);

he will folds all the hands that you beat and call with what beats you. No?

[/ QUOTE ] I'm not so sure about that. I think he calls with 88/99 any jack, and maybe ace high. I also feel he rarely has an overpair in this spot. Not saying saying betting is better than checking, but I do think he calls with hands that I beat. If he looks me up with something like AK,88,99,AJ/KJ then I'm slighly ahead of his range. If he shows up here with some unusally strong hands in this manner such as sets and QQ+ then checking is best. I'm just not sure if he ever has any of these hands after getting to the river like this.

[/ QUOTE ] Then call the raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

I was talking about his check calling range. His check raising range is another matter entirely. The question is now how often does he does this with complete air.