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-   -   C/Red on flop with toptop, this situation gives me a headache (http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=492614)

Aschweinsteiger 09-03-2007 12:23 PM

C/Red on flop with toptop, this situation gives me a headache
 
This hand took place with in the first 5 minutes of ths session and villan is a complete unknown. This is my first time playing 6max in 2 months so im a little off my Agame.
What do u think of my line here?

Fold the flop?
Raise all in on flop?
If im gonna raise all in on the turn i might as well have went all in on the flop right?
How often do u think i hae the best of it here?
Besides set,2pair, str8 does villans hand range even include a pair of jacks on flop/turn?

I want alot of criticism on this hand.

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $1.00 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

CO ($95.50)
Hero ($98.50)
SB ($129.15)
BB ($96.50)
UTG ($107)
MP ($142.70)

Preflop: Hero is Button with A[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, MP calls $1, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $5</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, BB calls $4, MP folds.

Flop: ($11.50) 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $8</font>, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises to $28</font>, Hero calls $20.

Turn: ($67.50) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">BB bets $35</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $65.5</font>, BB calls $28.50 (All-In).

River: ($194.50) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players, 1 all-in)</font>

Final Pot: $194.50

Aschweinsteiger 09-03-2007 01:01 PM

Re: C/Red on flop with toptop, this situation gives me a headache
 
someone say something

ToFarGone 09-03-2007 01:14 PM

Re: C/Red on flop with toptop, this situation gives me a headache
 
maybe i'm to nitty but i'd fold the flop vs. unknown.

FishSticks 09-03-2007 01:18 PM

Re: C/Red on flop with toptop, this situation gives me a headache
 
Fold the flop?

Nothing hugely wrong with that vs a total unknown. Lots of people at these stakes don't c/r worse than tptk.

Raise all in on flop?

Don't like that. Seems like you're going to fold out worse and get called by better always. If he's bluffing or has KJ or something, a call gets the money.

If im gonna raise all in on the turn i might as well have went all in on the flop right?

Not really, since a bunch of turns could put a 3flush and/or 4straight on the board which could change things depending on how he acts. Also, if he was c/r with a heart draw, the money is going in here on the turn with you as a huge fav - and prob more importantly KJ can't really fold now given pot odds.

How often do u think i hae the best of it here?
Besides set,2pair, str8 does villans hand range even include a pair of jacks on flop/turn?

So hard to say vs a total unknown. Against some you'll have the best of it very often. Against some you'll have the best of it literally NEVER. Since this guy is an unknown, I really don't think it's huge EV either way if you fold flop or take your line.

This doesn't look obviously bad to me or anything. Maybe just a touch aggro with literally zero reads.

Jamougha 09-03-2007 01:18 PM

Re: C/Red on flop with toptop, this situation gives me a headache
 
I tend to fold tp to a raise if there's an easy straight possible. If I called then sure I play the turn the same way.

HoldEmNewby 09-03-2007 01:57 PM

Re: C/Red on flop with toptop, this situation gives me a headache
 
I like a fold on this flop. Would he be check raising with KJ,QJ often enough to compensate for when he is doing this with 87,88,77,JJ,9T? I'd need a read to stay around in this one. I agree with Jamougha that if you call this flop you're def. playing for stacks on a non-heart, non-Queen,non-King turn.

APD0290 09-03-2007 05:53 PM

Re: C/Red on flop with toptop, this situation gives me a headache
 
I like it because the board is so drawy and Villain can easily have some draw like AhTh, Ah9h, 7h9h, etc, and now hes commited to call your turn shove with these hands. This hand would be a lot easier with some type of read but I think it's played fine.

Jay Riall 09-03-2007 05:54 PM

Re: C/Red on flop with toptop, this situation gives me a headache
 
I fold the flop pretty quickly in general.


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