200NL cash inside straight flush draw turn - bet or check?
 

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (2 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Hero ($201)
BB ($394)

Preflop: Hero is Button with Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
<font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $6</font>, BB calls $4.

Flop: ($12) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $8</font>, BB calls $8.

Turn: ($28) T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets $18</font>, BB calls $18.

River: ($64) K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
BB checks, Hero checks.

Final Pot: $64

On the turn - do you prefer a bet or a check? I think a bet here is all right especially when I am not afraid of a checkraise by villain. It builds a pot with an inside straight flush draw but it turns my middle pair on the flop into a bluff. Also, I think I played very weak by checking on the turn. When he called me a second time, I put him exactly on a nine (I was right) and a pot sized river bet would probably push him off a hand. I took like half a minute to check river and I regret it. I have to work on turning my hands with showdown value into a bluff.

However, what do you think about turn bet? Do you prefer a check or a bet?

Re: 200NL cash inside straight flush draw turn - bet or check?
 

What 9 did he have? I think it's going to be fairly difficult to push most players off many 9s here. They'd have to be convinced that you had an overpair, that you made 2 pair along the way, or that your flop bet was a continuation with overcard(s), and you caught the 6 outer. I think those are all hard sells against most players.

I'm no expert, so take this with a grain of salt, but I'd probably play the exact same way you did, and then scream in frustration when I realized that I missed 17 outs on the river.

[img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: 200NL cash inside straight flush draw turn - bet or check?
 

He had 96s. I sensed some weakness because he took a long time to call a bet on the turn. I just didn't go with a feeling. This was a mistake.

But I am much more interested in turn play in this hand because these situations (when you c bet and pick up a draw on the turn) come up a lot. IP, I guess it is better to bet, while OOP to check call?

Re: 200NL cash inside straight flush draw turn - bet or check?
 

You guys are deep enough that there will still be a subtantial amount left to bet on the river even if he checkraises the turn. If stacks were such that one raise would get you close to allin, that would be a key reason to check behind.

In this case, I would probably still check behind, because although that card improves your draw, it also improves a number of likely hands that he might be holding. (76 T9 T8 T7 JT J9 J8 J7 QJ QT).

But a bet can't be too wrong.

Re: 200NL cash inside straight flush draw turn - bet or check?
 

You need to build the pot on turn, so make it a potsized bet, you don't really mind getting raised here. A potsized bet could also make it easier to 3barrel-bluff once the K hits.

As played, I def. think you should make it somewhere close to pot on the river (it will work a lot).

Re: 200NL cash inside straight flush draw turn - bet or check?
 

Turn is an easy bet. As far as heads up goes, you have a decently strong hand. It's actually +ev compared to checking, because it hides your draw better if you hit, therefore you get paid off more- this is math that some people may or may not actually understand, some people will think they do but they really don't.

Re: 200NL cash inside straight flush draw turn - bet or check?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Turn is an easy bet. As far as heads up goes, you have a decently strong hand. It's actually +ev compared to checking, because it hides your draw better if you hit, therefore you get paid off more- this is math that some people may or may not actually understand, some people will think they do but they really don't.

[/ QUOTE ]

would you like to elaborate?

Re: 200NL cash inside straight flush draw turn - bet or check?
 

a bunch of your outs are not going to get you paid off particularly well -- the Q and the J will put up 4 to a straight on the board, opponent's going to tread cautiously.

agreed that the running flush will get you paid, but it will get you paid whether or not you bet turn.

Re: 200NL cash inside straight flush draw turn - bet or check?
 

I have 38% of winning plus fold equity on both streets so I believe including both of these factors it would be a profitable bet. I might make some EV calculations about this hand when I have time (not a math wizard but trying to become one).

Re: 200NL cash inside straight flush draw turn - bet or check?
 

as for the turn, what creed said

as for the river, if the ace or k hits, i think you should make that bet. other cards, i don't think enough of his range folds often enough to make a profit