Dealing with the \'and then?\' problem
 

Hey all,

I am struggling right now with what I'm sure anyone who is a rational and intelligent person struggles with at sometime in their life. Yeti touched on this in another thread about happiness but I want to take it a step further. Basically, it is dealing with the frustating consquences of this basic truth: that we are all (either subconsciously or consciously) trying to find meaning in our lives when existing is inherently meaningless and filled with arbitrary and essentially trivial day-to-day activities. I am looking less for a metadebate on the meaning of life and more for how people have dealt with their own search for meaning and purpose over the course of their lives who have far more experience than I do.

To give some background, I am 22 and by all measures have been very successful so far in life. Solid for money, good job, great girlfriend, etc. Life looks great. But I am just looking forward and thinking...'and then?'. So I move on after this job to a job that pays more, get married, buy a mortgage, get a better job, have kids, retire and in all that time find something to do that keeps me occupied until I die.

Part of this sudden realization I think is because I've rushed through so much of my life (skipped grades, rushed into gradschool) with the idea from my parents that life is some kind of race to the finish line and whoever is the most successful wins. I also come from a hyper-competitive family...all 3 of my siblings have or are getting PhDs from top schools in various fields, my parents both have advanced degrees, etc.

The other reason is I think I have satisfied my biological needs for the time-being (food, a place to live, love) and without those distractions (roaming bars every night looking for women, stressing out about financials) I have a lot more time to think about life.

Lately I've been questioning the whole and I've basically come to the conclusion that I can either completely refuse to participate in the rat race (become a bum, play poker, hang out all day, live the Dionysus style and just kind of do whatever), or give 100% (pursue an ambitious career, get an advanced degree, give it my best, become a world expert on some obscure international relations theory or manage someone's campaign or start a consulting firm) or just give it a good effort, put in the time at the 9-6 jobs but do it well and pursue other things that I find more interesting in whatever's left of my spare time. I'm leaning towards the latter right now.

I have a ton of distractions from this basic question. I have lots of great friends. I read tons...I'm on a current 19th Russian lit and existential philosophy kick (hmmm that could explain some things). I have poker, obviously (15 hrs a week on average). I just bought a sweet-ass music recording studio that I am going to fiddle around with and record my own music. I'm going to take a cooking course in the fall. I am trying to visit my friends more and spend time with them (I am going to DC this weekend to visit a buddy of mine). But I guess I am questioning...is life basically just this series of distractions until you die? Do we ever really find meaning in our lives or are we basically just using these things to take our mind off the fundamental issue...that our day-to-day lives tend to be filled with a lot of mundane, repetitive routine and that we are basically unnecessary?

I guess that is pretty depressing but in a way I think understanding this is very liberating and I'm looking for proactive solutions to deal with this realization.

Maybe I have just been reading too much existentialist literature. I am honestly a pretty upbeat person in general, good for a laugh, etc. but this has just been nagging at me for the last 6 months or so and I would like some help from EDF on this if you guys can provide it.

Cheers,
GW

Re: Dealing with the \'and then?\' problem
 

I think you will ultimately find a 'Dionysian' existance unfulfilling.

edit to add:
I also think you would not enjoy the 9-6 Office Space grind. You've got a great platform (poker) to launch an exploration into something that will interest and entertain you.

Also, remember you don't need to plan the rest of your life. If you've got something that interests you for 10 years, you can do quite a bit with it and then become an expert in something else.

I'd recommend you talk to an older person that you are friends with and find interesting (probably older than the typical 2+2 audience). See if you can find a role model.

Re: Dealing with the \'and then?\' problem
 

I'm 27 and I doubt my experience or knowledge of life is much different from yours. I have spent some time thinking about this though, and I have some conclusions I'm currently happy with.

There is no benefit in worrying about whether there's any point in what you're doing. You can probably make a good guess as to what your life will be like in the future, but you can never have a good degree of accuracy. The future is inherently unpredictable. Our best laid plans will never play out, something will always come along that changes them.

I think it's a good idea to have only a very vague long term plan, not to get too concerned about the details and not invest much of myself in trying to reach something ten/twenty years down the line. The future is far too hazy.

All that really matters is now, and enjoying what you have now. To make a bad analogy: When you run good at poker, it's important to enjoy it because you're sure going to dislike it when you next run bad. Then when you win, enjoy spending the money, but don't sweat it when you don't have as much next time round.

I don't like some people's escape route from the problem - i.e, your first option. Becoming a hermit and dropping out of society is making a bad bet. It protects you against a couple of unlikely future events at the cost of harming you with all of the other possible and more likely futures.

So, my plan is to live my life in such a way that I maximise my enjoyment without jeapodising any of the important things I want to do in the near/medium future. I do not know what the world is going to be like in 25, 50, 75 years and I do not know what I will be like. Neither does anybody else, and anyone who claims otherwise is a fraud or has not thought it through properly. Worrying about where I'll be is fruitless.

Re: Dealing with the \'and then?\' problem
 

Ive been struggling with this too a lot lately. Ive calmed down over the last 2 or 3 months, I dont go out too often, and am focusing on what I really want to do with my life. What I think makes me happy is the pursuit of being rich. I say what I "think" makes me happy because I dont know. Im a generally happy person, but Im not excited much anymore, when I was younger I used to get really excited abotu different things, now, not so much, it just seems like Im in a holding pattern. I honestly dont know if Im happy or what? My fear is that people are right when they say money cant buy you hapiness.

Re: Dealing with the \'and then?\' problem
 

I don't know why it's depressing, it's very liberating to me. An life that exists only to fulfill some specific purpose isn't worth living. If Thomas Jefferson got one thing right, it was that life is about liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Buddha was right about the central problem of life: it is basically suffering. We scratch out our existence between these two issues, the ideals we all think should be and the crushing reality of just how painful everything actually is if you are paying attention.

We all project that in some future we will be happy, when we are making more money or banging hotter chicks or when we solve some philosophical question or when we find God's grace but it's all an illusion. This is all there is and unless we can learn to exist in the moment and stop living in the future and in the past we will continue to fluctuate endlessly through a series of distractions. Mundane, repetitive tasks will destroy your soul and leave a withering husk if you really want to be somewhere else, doing something else, anything else. If you really care about getting the dishes clean, or sweeping the floor then those activities ARE enlightenment, they ARE life, there isn't anything else.

Re: Dealing with the \'and then?\' problem
 

GW, When you write these posts it always sounds like you don't know/understand what you're all about. Some of that is figuring out what doesn't concern you and what you can ignore. Once you figure that out everything is easier.

Re: Dealing with the \'and then?\' problem
 

[ QUOTE ]
GW, When you write these posts it always sounds like you don't know/understand what you're all about. Some of that is figuring out what doesn't concern you and what you can ignore. Once you figure that out everything is easier.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is pretty much the best worst advice I've ever seen. Or maybe the worst best advice. I can't decide yet. Regardless, it's true.

Rob

Re: Dealing with the \'and then?\' problem
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
GW, When you write these posts it always sounds like you don't know/understand what you're all about. Some of that is figuring out what doesn't concern you and what you can ignore. Once you figure that out everything is easier.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is pretty much the best worst advice I've ever seen. Or maybe the worst best advice. I can't decide yet. Regardless, it's true.

Rob

[/ QUOTE ]

If I understood myself 100% I wouldn't be asking this question because I would already know the answer. If I had a decent answer (or even a best-case compromise) I would stfu and go do it.

Re: Dealing with the \'and then?\' problem
 

I am struggling with a lot of the same issues right now.

Before last year I spent 5 years perusing a PhD in Electrical Engineering. I created nanoscale elctronic devices and measured them at cryogenic temperatures. It sounds cool right? A year after graduating I am in a postdoctoral Fellowship. My adviser here is leaving and wants to pass the lab on to me. Yesterday I walked in and told her the I am resigning my position. I just don't like it and it is not what I want to do with my life.

10 years ago I wish I had just told my parents to shove it when they said I should persue Physics instead of business. That was the height of the Tech bubble (97-98) and they felt tech was a good long term career. I am good at science. I would learn to like it.

Now I have no idea what to do with myself. I am at a crossroads. I own a real estate investment business but it is not enough yet to replace my income. I want to find something that I can be passionate about. I spent so much time trying to get to the finish line that I never stopped to think about what I really want to do and find meaningful in life.

+EV

Re: Dealing with the \'and then?\' problem
 

And maybe cut it out with the existential philosophy and read some Plotinus, Osho, Ken Wilber, or Thich Nhat Hanh. And do some yoga. And vipassana.