Hand #10 Stox book
 

$150-$300, 4 players
Preflop: Stox is CO with Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]T [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
Stox raises, button folds, sb 3-bets, bb folds, Stox calls

Flop: (7sb) A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]2 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
sb bets, Stox calls

Turn: (4.5bb) 8 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
sb bets, stox raises, sb calls

River: (8.5bb) K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
sb checks, Stox bets, sb calls

First of all, correct me if I'm wrong, but there seems to be a math error. It should be 8.5 bb on the river, not 12.5 bb, which what was written in the book.

However, my main reason for posting this was to ask why would Stox bet the river here? He didn't mention anything about why he bet the river in his explanation. However, what would the sb fold that he wouldn't on the turn? I don't think that it's anything that Stox doesn't already beat. If he called on the turn with a pair he's definately calling on the river when the king pairs the board for just one more bet.

Re: Hand #10 Stox book
 

I've seen better spots to bluff than this.

Re: Hand #10 Stox book
 

This is pretty retarded.

Re: Hand #10 Stox book
 

Not that the river bet is +ev for certain here, but it does make sense once the pot gets big enough.

Basically the reasoning is we hope the opponent thinks we might be doing a free sd play and is calling the turn with a hand that beats QT intending to dump to a river bet.

One other good thing, it will help your metagame knowing you are capable of pulling off this "bad" bluff.

Re: Hand #10 Stox book
 

[ QUOTE ]
Not that the river bet is +ev for certain here, but it does make sense once the pot gets big enough.

Basically the reasoning is we hope the opponent thinks we might be doing a free sd play and is calling the turn with a hand that beats QT intending to dump to a river bet.

One other good thing, it will help your metagame knowing you are capable of pulling off this "bad" bluff.

[/ QUOTE ]
So the sb will think that Stox is too good to make this "bad bluff" and have to have a hand. Then Stox can set him up for later and make the same play when he has the AK or whatever. As he said $150-$300 is about creative play.

Re: Hand #10 Stox book
 

Has the math error already been mentioned to 2+2?

Re: Hand #10 Stox book
 

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This is pretty retarded.

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I agree that stox was probably on drugs when he played this hand. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

In a vacuum this is a terrible bluff becuz the villains range will be too strong here once he bets the turn after stox calls the flop on this board. I also think the river bet is hopeless.

If one wants to make a play at this pot, there is only one place to do it, and thats on the flop becuz this is the street where the villain will be betting 100% of his range which means he will be betting with some hands that will have a hard time handling this flop raise. This dynamic is not true on the turn. When the typical player bets the turn here its all over. It's time to just hope we hit.

Re: Hand #10 Stox book
 

the flop and turn play I think are ok, though jamming the flop is a fine alternative. The river bet a mistake - I agree there.

Once called on the turn the only better hands that might fold the river is 8x with 2 spades but that might not even be in villain's PF 3 betting range.

Re: Hand #10 Stox book
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
This is pretty retarded.

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree that stox was probably on drugs when he played this hand. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

In a vacuum this is a terrible bluff becuz the villains range will be too strong here once he bets the turn after stox calls the flop on this board. I also think the river bet is hopeless.

If one wants to make a play at this pot, there is only one place to do it, and thats on the flop becuz this is the street where the villain will be betting 100% of his range which means he will be betting with some hands that will have a hard time handling this flop raise. This dynamic is not true on the turn. When the typical player bets the turn here its all over. It's time to just hope we hit.

[/ QUOTE ]
I think that you should do it more often then not on the flop. However, it's important to be deceptive and occasionally make this play on the turn.

Re: Hand #10 Stox book
 

thank god people think this hand is bad, I saw this thread and was like wow I guess I suck/ play weak poker, Id never do this.