fancy, standard or somewhere in between?
 

players have been 3 betting from the blinds a fair amount so I'm not certain if this is a blind defense or a legitimate hand. Player is TAP...

Full Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $0.25/$0.50 Blinds - 5 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter)

SB: $68.25
BB: $50.90
UTG: $81.35
CO: $46.25
Hero (BTN): $52.35

Preflop: Hero is dealt J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (5 Players)
2 folds, <font color="red">Hero raises to $1.75</font>, SB folds, <font color="red">BB raises to $5.50</font>, Hero calls $3.75

Flop: ($11.25) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">BB bets $8.00</font>, Hero calls $8.00

Turn: ($27.25) 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
BB checks, <font color="red">Hero bets all-in for $38.85</font>,

Re: fancy, standard or somewhere in between?
 

Man I'm not a fan at all of the pf call. If I'm gonna take a stand, its not with J4s. I guess the turn bet is ok, what are you trying to accomplish with it?

Will he fold an overpair here? Most likely not. Will he make a ballsy call with 88-TT? He might but you didnt really provide a read. I guess you protect from an overcard hitting, but I wonder if theres more value in seeing a river and making a decision if he checks/pushes. If he checked the turn with a big hand well then obv you got pwned.

Re: fancy, standard or somewhere in between?
 

If you're going to take a stand that 4 bet PF rather than calling with that junk.

Turn is terrible.

Re: fancy, standard or somewhere in between?
 

I agree the preflop is dicey. I'm surprised you think the turn is terrible.


I raised PF. SMoothcalled a reraise. Smoothcalled a flop bet... pushed turn. I'd play my overpairs and monsters the same way.

PF was because I had position and didn't want to cont to laydown when people are blind protecting

Re: fancy, standard or somewhere in between?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Man I'm not a fan at all of the pf call. If I'm gonna take a stand, its not with J4s. I guess the turn bet is ok, what are you trying to accomplish with it?

Will he fold an overpair here? Most likely not. Will he make a ballsy call with 88-TT? He might but you didnt really provide a read. I guess you protect from an overcard hitting, but I wonder if theres more value in seeing a river and making a decision if he checks/pushes. If he checked the turn with a big hand well then obv you got pwned.

[/ QUOTE ]

I have to ask you too... you're in villains shoes. Someone raises preflop... you reraise and he smoothcalls your reraise. You lead into him a psb and he calls. If the player isn't an idiot, you have to give him credit for a hand.

I wanted him to fold with my bet. But if he calls and I'm behind, I still likely have 14 outs. Plus, there's a chance my pair of Jacks is the best hand if he has AK, AQ or some mid pairs.

My intention preflop was to use my position and to attempt to discourage the blinds from 3 betting so often. The flop I'm semifloating (there's definitely a chance I'm ahead here)... once he checked the turn I thought my push had a reasonable chance of forcing a fold while giving me reasonable number of outs if he calls.

I agree pf is very iffy. But I'm not sure where my thinking is wrong on the turn.

Re: fancy, standard or somewhere in between?
 

Seiously... If he's not really tight and got like 90% fold to steal. (Includes SB). Or folds everything you need to fold this PF.

I think the push is better than a wellsized bet. Might pick upp some underdogs

Re: fancy, standard or somewhere in between?
 

What weaker hands will call? What stronger hands will fold?

The fact you have a hand is pretty much meaningless you could make this float with any 2 cards.

Re: fancy, standard or somewhere in between?
 

fold preflop.

a TIGHT AND PASSIVE player 3bets you preflop and you call with J4s [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

if this guy has 3bet lots from the blinds pre is very marginal at best.

flop is meh.

You are WB 60%+ of the time and you have to assume if he's rr preflop and betting the flop that he's going to follow through with a 2nd barrel a good chunk of the time so I hate flat calling here, we are only beating AK and air are often behind to QQ+/set.

I like the turn as played. He folds all worse hands - and *maybe* AJs calls with his OP/set hands (we are 30% dog to those)

If you do some math the times he calls you with QQ/set you lose ~25.90/hand.

If he folds you make 27.20.

If you add in a couple of times where he calls with worse hands AKdd maybe but rarely 89/9Tdd.

If he folds to your push more than 40% of the time or so I think it's +EV.

Re: fancy, standard or somewhere in between?
 

WTH are you doing.. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Re: fancy, standard or somewhere in between?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I agree the preflop is dicey. I'm surprised you think the turn is terrible.


I raised PF. SMoothcalled a reraise. Smoothcalled a flop bet... pushed turn. I'd play my overpairs and monsters the same way.

PF was because I had position and didn't want to cont to laydown when people are blind protecting

[/ QUOTE ]

Nobody at these tables is gonna remember what you did with overcards.