Two Plus Two Newer Archives - Flopping middle set

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Flopping middle set

First time I sat down at minbet holdem. No reads so far. Do you like my play?

Party Poker
Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $0.10/$0.2
10 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (10 players) Hero is BB with T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, 3 folds, SB calls, Hero raises, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, SB calls.

Flop: T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (18SB, 6 players)
SB checks, Hero bets, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 raises, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, SB folds, Hero 3-bets, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 caps, MP1 calls, MP2 calls, Hero calls, UTG+1 calls.

Turn: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (24BB, 5 players)
Hero bets, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 raises, MP1 folds, MP2 calls, Hero calls, UTG+1 calls.

River: 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (32BB, 4 players)
Hero bets, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 raises, MP2 folds, Hero 3-bets, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 caps, Hero calls.

Results:
Final pot: 45BB
UTG+2 balance 8.30 bet 1.80 collected 6.30 net 4.50 5c 5h 
Hero balance 2.30 lost 1.80 Ts Td

Re: Flopping middle set

I'm not convinced at all that you are beat on the turn. The rest is good.

Re: Flopping middle set

First: One raise preflop and 6 players in the pot gives 12 sb and not 18. I will assume there is only 12 sb in the pot.

Fine with raising the preflop.
Flop: You probably have the best hand so bet out is fine. I also like the raising. By checking you risk giving freecards to the whole table.

Turn: yo may worry about UTG+2 goes crazy - he may have a higher set but it is unlikely since he didn't raise preflop. AQ giving him a straight is also a preflopraisinghand. The only hand that you really worry about is Q9 then but that is normally not a playable hand from UTG.
Conclusion: I'd threebet the turn to make at least one of them pay dearly for their flush draw.

River: I don't understand your line here(EDIT: I actually do now if you wrote off the setpossibilities on the flop but isn't that a mistake). You backed of on the turn because you feared your were behind. Now I see you only worried about a straight and not a set because anyone having a set on the turn will beat you now.
Should we bet out? Well, the flushdrawers will fold and we may get a call from a straight(doubtful if anyone has it)two pairs or weaker. So betting out can be defended but I don't like the reraise. Call the raise.

EDIT: As your handhistory indicates the converter might have forgotten a UTG+2 raise before the flop. If that is the case we have another analysis. As far as I can see it with utg+2 not raising preflop I put him on 55 or Q9(maybe clubs) - mostly sure to guess 55 because of the riverplay, but on the turn I was very much in doubt if he had a straight or 55. But tended also much to the 5's- That's why you should reraise.

Re: Flopping middle set

i might cap the turn regardless since the pot's so big and it seems like people are coming along anyway...i'd cap the river too. nh.

Re: Flopping middle set

at .1/.2 you prolly need to cap it all teh wayzyozioyo

Re: Flopping middle set

I probably 3bet the turn and check/call a river bet if you don't fill up and UTG+2 caps the turn. With him going crazy on the flop, I don't put him on JJ (from the lack of a PFR) and I find it hard, although possible, that he has a straight. Since you did fill up, I play it the same.

Re: Flopping middle set

I'd probably 3bet the turn as well, depending on my opinion of the villain. You certainly could be behind, but I wouldn't discount the possiblity the villain has something like Ac5c, TJ or even J5. He might have assumed you had an overpair from your preraise.

With three other callers you don't need to be ahead very often for a re-raise to be profitable.

Re: Flopping middle set

I probably slow down on the river. Players in microlimits usually only push like this if they have a VERY good hand. By the turn 3 bet I would have him on JJ and be looking to show it down for 1 bet if I could get away with it. 3 bet on the flop actually makes me feel better because players at this level dont usually jam the pot for value.

[ QUOTE ]

River: 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (32BB, 4 players)
Hero bets, UTG+1 calls, UTG+2 raises, MP2 folds, Hero 3-bets, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 caps, Hero calls.

Results:
Final pot: 45BB
UTG+2 balance 8.30 bet 1.80 collected 6.30 net 4.50 5c 5h 
Hero balance 2.30 lost 1.80 Ts Td 

[/ QUOTE ]

You usually can't predict quads in a situation like this. Textbook "Bad beat"

Re: Flopping middle set

I'm putting UTG+2 on JT for a flopped two pair, and am betting all the way here against these calling stations. Only hands that UTG+2 could have that you would lose to is Q9 - and he was correctly was re-raising his OESD after the flop with 6 players in the hand - JJ, 55, or AcQc. Everything else you are ahead of. With his aggression, I would think he would have raised JJ pre-flop. No way he caps the flop with AQ offsuit - but it would certainly be correct for him to do that with AcQc because of the calling stations.

Only thing I think you could have done differently here is capped the turn.

Curious to hear how this hand turned out.

- Spike