That was SOOO not the card I wanted to see.
 

Typical $2/$4 game where you flop the nuts...

PokerRoom 2/4 Hold'em (5 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is BB with 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
UTG calls, MP calls, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, SB completes, Hero checks.

Flop: (4 SB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">SB bets</font>, Hero calls, UTG calls, <font color="#CC3333">MP raises</font>, SB calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, UTG calls, <font color="#CC3333">MP caps</font>, SB calls, Hero calls, UTG calls.

Turn: (10 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG calls, <font color="#CC3333">MP raises</font>, SB folds, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, UTG calls, MP calls.

River: (19 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
Hero ?????

Now what?!?

Re: That was SOOO not the card I wanted to see.
 

I bet/call against unknowns. Reads really determine your action here though.

Re: That was SOOO not the card I wanted to see.
 

check/call. If this was Heads up with MP I'd bet/call. Here I think I check/call. Someone is betting so If I am ahead I get my value and no C/R. I check and am willing to overcall. I fold if it is 2 back to me.

LLL

Re: That was SOOO not the card I wanted to see.
 

The others were fairly new to the table, but I had been playing with MP for a while today and last night. He seemed pretty decent, and I hadn't seen him really get out of line. In fact, based on his actions during on the hand, I was reasonably sure he had a set.

Re: That was SOOO not the card I wanted to see.
 

[ QUOTE ]
The others were fairly new to the table, but I had been playing with MP for a while today and last night. He seemed pretty decent, and I hadn't seen him really get out of line. In fact, based on his actions during on the hand, I was reasonably sure he had a set.

[/ QUOTE ]

What percentage were you sure? 50%, 75%, 90%

LLL

Re: That was SOOO not the card I wanted to see.
 

Yeah, sucky river card...

Flop: I think you have to raise SB's bet. I know it's tempting to want to slowplay the flopped nuts, but:

- straights are really vulnerable hands
- there's no good reason to expect that it's going to get raised behind you
- SB may not lead into you again on the turn if he's donking with a flush draw

I bet and call one more bet back to me if it gets raised. If, however, UTG flushed (wtf else could he have?) and MP filled up (likely?), it could be 2 back to you and you'll have a decision. If UTG has a weakish flush, he probably won't raise, allowing you to showdown for one more bet.


Tom

Re: That was SOOO not the card I wanted to see.
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The others were fairly new to the table, but I had been playing with MP for a while today and last night. He seemed pretty decent, and I hadn't seen him really get out of line. In fact, based on his actions during on the hand, I was reasonably sure he had a set.

[/ QUOTE ]

What percentage were you sure? 50%, 75%, 90%

LLL

[/ QUOTE ]

My gut was telling me 90+%

Re: That was SOOO not the card I wanted to see.
 

Since I was 90% sure MP had a set, I checked the river...

River: (19 BB) 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP raises</font>, Hero ?????

Re: That was SOOO not the card I wanted to see.
 

I lay this down 100% of the time. even thought the pot is huge, I don't get a consolation prize for coming in third.

LLL

PS the fact that you posted this tells me that UTG had A6 and MP had 37 right?

LLL

Re: That was SOOO not the card I wanted to see.
 

[ QUOTE ]
Flop: I think you have to raise SB's bet. I know it's tempting to want to slowplay the flopped nuts, but:

- straights are really vulnerable hands
- there's no good reason to expect that it's going to get raised behind you
- SB may not lead into you again on the turn if he's donking with a flush draw

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm fine with the Slowplay on the flop(especially with the Back-Trey when raised, Lovely) You are very correct when you say that Hero's straight is vulnerable on this board, but raising doesn't make it any less vulnerable. Flush draws will still call, correctly. There are however a lot of OC hands that would call 1 bet but fold for 2 that we would like to catch up. I like the idea of being able to punish the flush draws on the big streets with a raise. Sure they will probably still call, and sometimes still have the odds to do so correctly, but we gain the most when they miss. We really aren't looking to get raised when we call here, we just don't mind if we do cuz it gives us the opportunity to 3-bet. SB checking the Turn is no big deal either, we bet and likely gain more value the large percentage of times our hand is good at showdown.

Our only real tough decision with this play is when the 3rd heart comes off on the Turn. That's poker though.