How should a society deal with drugs?
 

Having read some opinions from people who are Acist i am curious to find out why they are against the current system with tough drug laws.
If i have understood things correctly you want drugs to be legal and available to everyone?
Drugs are dangerous to humans and that's why they are illegal. You believe in the persons free will to decide whether he wants to take them or not?

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

Societies don't act. Once you accept that, the answer should be fairly intuitive.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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Societies don't act. Once you accept that, the answer should be fairly intuitive.

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Of course, stupid of me, if you were to deal with drugs in the current society, what would you wish and for what reasons?

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

Why are they dangerous?

If you use them irresponsibly and cause harm, you are liable for the damage you cause. If you cause harm to yourself, you can and probably will do harm to yourself anyway. If they are decriminalized, do you think there'll be a mad dash for people to start using hard core drugs? Why? Just because they aren't criminal, all of a sudden most people don't care about their kids, their jobs, their bodies, their lives? That's absurd. Some will use them, and if they abuse them, they'll have a heavy price to pay.

Almost everything is dangerous to humans -- driving, eating red meat, drinking hard liquor, working all week, playing sports, using gas grills, having sex, climbing ladders ... let's ban it all.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

I think whether you abuse drugs or not you may easily find yourself addicted to them and that's when your problems start.
Of course some may harm or kill you right away.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think whether you abuse drugs or not you may easily find yourself addicted to them and that's when your problems start.
Of course some may harm or kill you right away.

[/ QUOTE ]

Junk food, promiscuous sex, liquor, internet poker, adrenaline sports, internet politics forums are addictive as well. If people KNOW something has a high risk of addiction and CHOOSE to partake in it anyway, why do you think it's your job to use violence to stop them?

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

Because drug abuse is a medical problem, not a criminal one. We should offer treatment, rather than lock up people. Do you know how much jail space we use for non-violent drug users? We let murderers out early to make room for people who never hurt anyone, they just used drugs.

I guess you have to ask, why don't we lock up alcoholics, people who smoke or get high sniffing glue or paint? How about those that eat a lot of fatty foods? Those people are all hurting their own bodies, but nobody else. Same with drug users. But why give treatment to one segment, and arrest others?

Drug users haven't hurt anybody. If they kill someone, or steal property to feed their drug habit, yeah, then you can arrest them. But until that point, it should be treated as the medical problem it is.

Ron Paul clip, in case you haven't seen it. Try really listen to what he's saying. He sums it up pretty well in 30 seconds. =)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=88REf0tjZHo

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

Drugs have been used since the dawn of time, it's a very modern idea that some should be restricted.
I have some experience of the pros as well as the cons so I know they can be dangerous.
I do think that if legalised it would save a lot of money as well of removing some of the "do drugs to be a rebel" mentality that many teenagers have.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

Drugs are considered bad because the negative effects are severe, yet uncertain. Authoritarians think that the uncertainty of the punishment is insufficent to steer people away from something dangerous, so they want to deter people...with severe and uncertain punishments.

There is no reason to believe that in a world without drug punishment, the majority of the population will degenerate into an orgy of self-gratifying heroin addicts. Very few people who are not deterred by the illegality of drugs will do the ones that are actually dangerous (speed, heroin, crack).

It should also be mentioned that during the industrial revolution, heroin was not only 100% legal, widely available and cheap; it's negative effects were also very unknown. It was sold in cough medicine over the counter to children, and the fears of modern day social conservatives did not manifest. In fact, during this time the most feared and loathed drug of the time was alcohol. It brought about more anti-social effects than any other chemical recreant in existence (and having indulged in many of them myself, I am inclined to agree).

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Drugs have been used since the dawn of time, it's a very modern idea that some should be restricted.
I have some experience of the pros as well as the cons so I know they can be dangerous.
I do think that if legalised it would save a lot of money as well of removing some of the "do drugs to be a rebel" mentality that many teenagers have.

[/ QUOTE ]

Frankly, I think if parents just sat down with their teenage kids and smoked a joint with them, pot would lose all of its coolness.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Drugs have been used since the dawn of time, it's a very modern idea that some should be restricted.
I have some experience of the pros as well as the cons so I know they can be dangerous.
I do think that if legalised it would save a lot of money as well of removing some of the "do drugs to be a rebel" mentality that many teenagers have.

[/ QUOTE ]

Frankly, I think if parents just sat down with their teenage kids and smoked a joint with them, pot would lose all of its coolness.

[/ QUOTE ]

QFT

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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I think whether you abuse drugs or not you may easily find yourself addicted to them and that's when your problems start.
Of course some may harm or kill you right away.

[/ QUOTE ]

Junk food, promiscuous sex, liquor, internet poker, adrenaline sports, internet politics forums are addictive as well. If people KNOW something has a high risk of addiction and CHOOSE to partake in it anyway, why do you think it's your job to use violence to stop them?

[/ QUOTE ]

You can't compare sport nor internet politics to drugs.
So you would rather live in a society where drugs existed and where legal and easy to come by? Does anyone benefit from drugs in any way? Why have it around when it only spreads decadency and in worst case death? What are the positive effects of it? are there any?

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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Frankly, I think if parents just sat down with their teenage kids and smoked a joint with them, pot would lose all of its coolness.

[/ QUOTE ]
People don't smoke pot because it's cool, they do it because it gives them a break from their lives, their fears, their frustrations, and their unimaginative personality.

And your point is pretty much contradicted by the correlation between parents smoking cigarettes and doing drugs in the home and the habits of their children.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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Why have it around when it only spreads decadency and in worst case death? What are the positive effects of it? are there any?

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If it only spread death and had zero positive aspects, then there'd be no demand for it, so put doen your gun and don't worry about it.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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Why have it around when it only spreads decadency and in worst case death? What are the positive effects of it? are there any?

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If it only spread death and had zero positive aspects, then there'd be no demand for it, so put doen your gun and don't worry about it.

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Worst case is not equal to only spread death. Don't change my words. And i have no gun and i don't worry about it. Just curious to understand different peoples opinions and why they have them, that's all.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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I think whether you abuse drugs or not you may easily find yourself addicted to them and that's when your problems start.
Of course some may harm or kill you right away.

[/ QUOTE ]

Junk food, promiscuous sex, liquor, internet poker, adrenaline sports, internet politics forums are addictive as well. If people KNOW something has a high risk of addiction and CHOOSE to partake in it anyway, why do you think it's your job to use violence to stop them?

[/ QUOTE ]

You can't compare sport nor internet politics to drugs.
So you would rather live in a society where drugs existed and where legal and easy to come by? Does anyone benefit from drugs in any way? Why have it around when it only spreads decadency and in worst case death? What are the positive effects of it? are there any?

[/ QUOTE ]

It gives people a good feeling, relieves stress and pain. Plus for entertainment purposes.

I mean what's the "benefit" of candy? What's the benefit of beer? I mean what's the benefit of movies? It creates no value in our society, produces nothing tangible, except entertainment.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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Frankly, I think if parents just sat down with their teenage kids and smoked a joint with them, pot would lose all of its coolness.

[/ QUOTE ]
People don't smoke pot because it's cool, they do it because it gives them a break from their lives, their fears, their frustrations, and their unimaginative personality.

And your point is pretty much contradicted by the correlation between parents smoking cigarettes and doing drugs in the home and the habits of their children.

[/ QUOTE ]

My point was not that it would take away the enjoyable benefits of THC, but that it would lose its value as a rebellion factor.

Although, given that even adults can over fetishize alcohol and cigarettes, I think I have to at least partially concede this point.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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[ QUOTE ]
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I think whether you abuse drugs or not you may easily find yourself addicted to them and that's when your problems start.
Of course some may harm or kill you right away.

[/ QUOTE ]

Junk food, promiscuous sex, liquor, internet poker, adrenaline sports, internet politics forums are addictive as well. If people KNOW something has a high risk of addiction and CHOOSE to partake in it anyway, why do you think it's your job to use violence to stop them?

[/ QUOTE ]

You can't compare sport nor internet politics to drugs.
So you would rather live in a society where drugs existed and where legal and easy to come by? Does anyone benefit from drugs in any way? Why have it around when it only spreads decadency and in worst case death? What are the positive effects of it? are there any?

[/ QUOTE ]

It gives people a good feeling, relieves stress and pain. Plus for entertainment purposes.

I mean what's the "benefit" of candy? What's the benefit of beer? I mean what's the benefit of movies? It creates no value in our society, produces nothing tangible, except entertainment.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am not talking about marijuana here. Stop comparing it to things that can't instantly kill you if you overdose or severely damage your brains etc.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
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I think whether you abuse drugs or not you may easily find yourself addicted to them and that's when your problems start.
Of course some may harm or kill you right away.

[/ QUOTE ]

Junk food, promiscuous sex, liquor, internet poker, adrenaline sports, internet politics forums are addictive as well. If people KNOW something has a high risk of addiction and CHOOSE to partake in it anyway, why do you think it's your job to use violence to stop them?

[/ QUOTE ]

You can't compare sport nor internet politics to drugs.
So you would rather live in a society where drugs existed and where legal and easy to come by? Does anyone benefit from drugs in any way? Why have it around when it only spreads decadency and in worst case death? What are the positive effects of it? are there any?

[/ QUOTE ]

It gives people a good feeling, relieves stress and pain. Plus for entertainment purposes.

I mean what's the "benefit" of candy? What's the benefit of beer? I mean what's the benefit of movies? It creates no value in our society, produces nothing tangible, except entertainment.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am not talking about marijuana here. Stop comparing it to things that can't instantly kill you if you overdose or severely damage your brains etc.

[/ QUOTE ]

He didn't say marijuana.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

In Sweden prostitution is illegal. If a women decides nonetheless that she wants to sell her body she will not be punished for it, only the person to whom she sells herself to will be(not severely). What if you were to have the same system on drugs only in reverse? Punish those who sell but not those who buy?

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

[ QUOTE ]
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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
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I think whether you abuse drugs or not you may easily find yourself addicted to them and that's when your problems start.
Of course some may harm or kill you right away.

[/ QUOTE ]

Junk food, promiscuous sex, liquor, internet poker, adrenaline sports, internet politics forums are addictive as well. If people KNOW something has a high risk of addiction and CHOOSE to partake in it anyway, why do you think it's your job to use violence to stop them?

[/ QUOTE ]

You can't compare sport nor internet politics to drugs.
So you would rather live in a society where drugs existed and where legal and easy to come by? Does anyone benefit from drugs in any way? Why have it around when it only spreads decadency and in worst case death? What are the positive effects of it? are there any?

[/ QUOTE ]

It gives people a good feeling, relieves stress and pain. Plus for entertainment purposes.

I mean what's the "benefit" of candy? What's the benefit of beer? I mean what's the benefit of movies? It creates no value in our society, produces nothing tangible, except entertainment.

[/ QUOTE ]

I am not talking about marijuana here. Stop comparing it to things that can't instantly kill you if you overdose or severely damage your brains etc.

[/ QUOTE ]

He didn't say marijuana.

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I know he didn't, i was simply mentioning the only drug that is not dangerous in the same way. Stop wasting my time Kaj.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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I think whether you abuse drugs or not you may easily find yourself addicted to them and that's when your problems start.
Of course some may harm or kill you right away.

[/ QUOTE ]

The potential for drugs to harm or kill you right away is drastically overblown and mostly a product of prohibition to boot. Because drug users have no option but to deal with a black market, many of the quality-control mechanisms present in free markets are not there such as a reliable and consistent source, consumer reporting groups, hell even government regulated safety standards if you're into that. Even a drug that is as full-out as heroin can be used responsibly for an entire lifetime as long as it's not abused. Its a lot easier to overdose when you aren't sure how pure the product your using is or what impurities it has. Another example, most times when people get severely screwed up on ecstasy it's because they took pills from a "bad batch". If a large company operating in a free market provided the ecstasy the possibility of it being chemically bad approaches 0. When was the last time you felt uncomfortable taking tylenol because you were afraid the manufacturers executed the chemical extraction wrong?

As for addiction, nobody will deny that some drugs are ridiculously addictive. It's a sad state of affairs that people suffering from a substance abuse problem have severely curtailed resources for getting help because they're criminals in the eyes of society. Not only have you exacerbated the plight of the unfortunate by instituting prohibition, you've restricted the freedoms of responsible drug users everywhere from enjoying something they truly value. There are drug experiences that can be immensely rewarding and constructive for those that approach things responsibly. This should be clear from the fact that countless human cultures have based meditative practices, lifestyles, and entire religions around them. This deep, nuanced, and fascinating aspect of the human experience has been all but cut away by modern society.

I'm pretty much rambling now, but one last thought. The artificially high prices that black markets create compound the problems too. People point to the fact that some junkies steal for their high and this is a reason that drugs should be illegal. It's not uncommon for hookers in a place like Atlantic City to spend between 100 and 200 dollars per day on their fix. If prohibition were ended they could support their habits for no more than it costs to buy a pack of cigarettes a day. Most drugs (there are exceptions, alcohol among others) don't tend to make people a nuisance to society until they are dry and hurting for a fix and starting into a withdrawal phase. There is no reason I or anyone else should ever be robbed, assaulted, or hassled by somebody because they can't afford their next fix, end prohibition and let these people get high in their crappy apartments in between shifts at McDonalds (or even in between receiving their welfare checks, if that's your kind of thing).

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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[ QUOTE ]
I think whether you abuse drugs or not you may easily find yourself addicted to them and that's when your problems start.
Of course some may harm or kill you right away.

[/ QUOTE ]

The potential for drugs to harm or kill you right away is drastically overblown and mostly a product of prohibition to boot. Because drug users have no option but to deal with a black market, many of the quality-control mechanisms present in free markets are not there such as a reliable and consistent source, consumer reporting groups, hell even government regulated safety standards if you're into that. Even a drug that is as full-out as heroin can be used responsibly for an entire lifetime as long as it's not abused. Its a lot easier to overdose when you aren't sure how pure the product your using is or what impurities it has. Another example, most times when people get severely screwed up on ecstasy it's because they took pills from a "bad batch". If a large company operating in a free market provided the ecstasy the possibility of it being chemically bad approaches 0. When was the last time you felt uncomfortable taking tylenol because you were afraid the manufacturers executed the chemical extraction wrong?

As for addiction, nobody will deny that some drugs are ridiculously addictive. It's a sad state of affairs that people suffering from a substance abuse problem have severely curtailed resources for getting help because they're criminals in the eyes of society. Not only have you exacerbated the plight of the unfortunate by instituting prohibition, you've restricted the freedoms of responsible drug users everywhere from enjoying something they truly value. There are drug experiences that can be immensely rewarding and constructive for those that approach things responsibly. This should be clear from the fact that countless human cultures have based meditative practices, lifestyles, and entire religions around them. This deep, nuanced, and fascinating aspect of the human experience has been all but cut away by modern society.

I'm pretty much rambling now, but one last thought. The artificially high prices that black markets create compound the problems too. People point to the fact that some junkies steal for their high and this is a reason that drugs should be illegal. It's not uncommon for hookers in a place like Atlantic City to spend between 100 and 200 dollars per day on their fix. If prohibition were ended they could support their habits for no more than it costs to buy a pack of cigarettes a day. Most drugs (there are exceptions, alcohol among others) don't tend to make people a nuisance to society until they are dry and hurting for a fix and starting into a withdrawal phase. There is no reason I or anyone else should ever be robbed, assaulted, or hassled by somebody because they can't afford their next fix, end prohibition and let these people get high in their crappy apartments in between shifts at McDonalds (or even in between receiving their welfare checks, if that's your kind of thing).

[/ QUOTE ]

Stop wasting his time AWoodside. Everybody knows that drugs are straight poison that will kill you if you even say their names aloud.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

[ QUOTE ]
In Sweden prostitution is illegal. If a women decides nonetheless that she wants to sell her body she will not be punished for it, only the person to whom she sells herself to will be(not severely). What if you were to have the same system on drugs only in reverse? Punish those who sell but not those who buy?

[/ QUOTE ]

That would be a step in the right direction I suppose. This would help unclog our prison system of non-violent offenders and allow police resources to focus on more important things, however, because dealers would still have to operate apart from the law you wouldn't do away with a lot of the black-market drawbacks that make the whole thing such a mess. You would still have terrorist groups, brutal third world dictators, and domestic gangs funded through the drug trade (although it would be interesting to consider in more depth the degree to which this would be mitigated in your scenario) and all the other misappropriation of resources and excuses to expand government power into spheres it has no business being in.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think whether you abuse drugs or not you may easily find yourself addicted to them and that's when your problems start.
Of course some may harm or kill you right away.

[/ QUOTE ]

The potential for drugs to harm or kill you right away is drastically overblown and mostly a product of prohibition to boot. Because drug users have no option but to deal with a black market, many of the quality-control mechanisms present in free markets are not there such as a reliable and consistent source, consumer reporting groups, hell even government regulated safety standards if you're into that. Even a drug that is as full-out as heroin can be used responsibly for an entire lifetime as long as it's not abused. Its a lot easier to overdose when you aren't sure how pure the product your using is or what impurities it has. Another example, most times when people get severely screwed up on ecstasy it's because they took pills from a "bad batch". If a large company operating in a free market provided the ecstasy the possibility of it being chemically bad approaches 0. When was the last time you felt uncomfortable taking tylenol because you were afraid the manufacturers executed the chemical extraction wrong?

As for addiction, nobody will deny that some drugs are ridiculously addictive. It's a sad state of affairs that people suffering from a substance abuse problem have severely curtailed resources for getting help because they're criminals in the eyes of society. Not only have you exacerbated the plight of the unfortunate by instituting prohibition, you've restricted the freedoms of responsible drug users everywhere from enjoying something they truly value. There are drug experiences that can be immensely rewarding and constructive for those that approach things responsibly. This should be clear from the fact that countless human cultures have based meditative practices, lifestyles, and entire religions around them. This deep, nuanced, and fascinating aspect of the human experience has been all but cut away by modern society.

I'm pretty much rambling now, but one last thought. The artificially high prices that black markets create compound the problems too. People point to the fact that some junkies steal for their high and this is a reason that drugs should be illegal. It's not uncommon for hookers in a place like Atlantic City to spend between 100 and 200 dollars per day on their fix. If prohibition were ended they could support their habits for no more than it costs to buy a pack of cigarettes a day. Most drugs (there are exceptions, alcohol among others) don't tend to make people a nuisance to society until they are dry and hurting for a fix and starting into a withdrawal phase. There is no reason I or anyone else should ever be robbed, assaulted, or hassled by somebody because they can't afford their next fix, end prohibition and let these people get high in their crappy apartments in between shifts at McDonalds (or even in between receiving their welfare checks, if that's your kind of thing).

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Very well put, I'm glad somebody could articulate this for me.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

Awoodside, It is probably as you say. Many drugs or not well done and also not safe because of that. And, the war on drugs in the us probably cause way more damage then if the drugs were legal. Still it remains true that because they are so addictive it is hard to remain and normal individual. They will consume you.
Also the rewards you mentioned are not the kind of productive human achievements i was referring to.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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[ QUOTE ]
Drugs have been used since the dawn of time, it's a very modern idea that some should be restricted.
I have some experience of the pros as well as the cons so I know they can be dangerous.
I do think that if legalised it would save a lot of money as well of removing some of the "do drugs to be a rebel" mentality that many teenagers have.

[/ QUOTE ]

Frankly, I think if parents just sat down with their teenage kids and smoked a joint with them, pot would lose all of its coolness.

[/ QUOTE ]

I can confirm from experience that this is true. As soon as I realised smoking cannabis was "acceptable" in my family I lost interest in it. I think the same would happen WHEN society learns to accept drug use and legalise it.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

I think its insane to get sent to prison for doing drugs. People should do what they want as long as they are affecting them selfs only. The war on drugs is a failure and cause mayhem on many different levels.
But how can we accept drugs to be available? what good comes from them?

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Drugs have been used since the dawn of time, it's a very modern idea that some should be restricted.
I have some experience of the pros as well as the cons so I know they can be dangerous.
I do think that if legalised it would save a lot of money as well of removing some of the "do drugs to be a rebel" mentality that many teenagers have.

[/ QUOTE ]

Frankly, I think if parents just sat down with their teenage kids and smoked a joint with them, pot would lose all of its coolness.

[/ QUOTE ]

I can confirm from experience that this is true. As soon as I realised smoking cannabis was "acceptable" in my family I lost interest in it. I think the same would happen WHEN society learns to accept drug use and legalise it.

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While I can appreciate that this was true for you, I doubt that it would be the case for society in general. Just look at alcohol, which is for the most part accepted and legal in American society. It's abused all the time. There is definitely a subset of drug users that get into it because they're feeling rebellious and what-not, and acceptance would probably effect that groups aggregate behavior in one way or another, but as far as a widespread shift in frequency of use, I think you're being a bit optimistic.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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Drug users haven't hurt anybody.

[/ QUOTE ] Actually they are almost necessarily supporting organizations which have hurt people.

It's also worth mentioning that these organizations would never have been able to hurt people if the drugs were legal in the first place.

Wait...did I just use a straw man?

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think its insane to get sent to prison for doing drugs. People should do what they want as long as they are affecting them selfs only. The war on drugs is a failure and cause mayhem on many different levels.
But how can we accept drugs to be available? what good comes from them?

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There is a false-dichotomy that gets employed a lot when talking about government regulation/social engineering in general: prohibition or endorsement. Just because you don't prohibit something doesn't mean you're actively promoting its use. You could ask what good comes from a lot of things. What good comes from pringles for example? Not a whole lot in my opinion (mostly because I'm a singularity-seeking health-nut), but this just brings us to the point that value is subjective. Drugs may not do a lot of good for you personally, but they obviously do for some people or they wouldn't be using them. If you're looking for something more substantive than that I'm sure we can think of something. A lot of art and music, for example, is inspired by drug use. Paul Erdos, one of the greatest mathematicians of the 20th century relied heavily on strong amphetamines throughout his life and (according to his own meticulous self-analysis and experimentation) would not have been able to come to the insights he had without them. That's anecdotal of course but serves to illustrate that some people are able to augment their life-styles with the appropriate use of drugs. I know a nationally ranked marathon runner who uses marijuana while he trains and races because he believes it allows him to keep his body relaxed, which is extremely important in an endurance event where any slight inefficiency gets compounded over several hours.

Coming from a different angle, deregulated drugs would "do good" in the same way any consumer product does good in society. It would create jobs and business opportunities while encouraging innovation in certain chemistry and pharmaceutical fields. If you can think of any good that comes from Hostess Cupcakes existing in the marketplace the same could be said of drugs.

The bottom line, however, is that even if you can't readily discern some social good that comes from them, that is not nearly enough of a reason to start infringing on people's liberty. The onus of proof is on you if you want to start dictating what people can and can't do and I think you would agree that the bar should be much higher than just not being able to see what good comes from some activity.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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I am not talking about marijuana here. Stop comparing it to things that can't instantly kill you if you overdose or severely damage your brains etc.

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http://www.americanscientist.org/con...104938_847.jpg

Most drugs are not much more lethal than alcohol, many are less. The distinctions between legal and illegal drugs are arbitrary.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

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I am not talking about marijuana here. Stop comparing it to things that can't instantly kill you if you overdose or severely damage your brains etc.

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http://www.americanscientist.org/con...104938_847.jpg

Most drugs are not much more lethal than alcohol, many are less. The distinctions between legal and illegal drugs are arbitrary.

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The insanity of drug prohibition is never made more stark than when viewed in the context of our culture's approach to alcohol. There are swaths of college kids in the US that routinely, as in 2-3 times per week, ingest upwards of 50% of a lethal dose of alcohol. This is viewed for the most part as "kids being kids". While this is going on we have mandatory minimum sentencing in many places for pot possession. I don't have a ton of experience with a ton of different drugs, mainly because I try to do a lot of research and proceed cautiously when it comes to new experiences, but I can say without a shadow of a doubt that the closest I have ever been to death in my life thus far has been due to alcohol-related decisions I've made. Stupid, stupid stupid.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

"Just because you don't prohibit something doesn't mean you're actively promoting its use."

My logic goes like this. We know that many drugs are highly addicting with a lot of negative impacts on our health and we know what that addiction can lead to. In my opinion it seems irresponsible of a society not to be against something that has this affect on us. Why leave it open for others to find out what kind of hell drugs has to offer?

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

"The insanity of drug prohibition is never made more stark than when viewed in the context of our culture's approach to alcohol."

This sentence is very true when viewing that graph and it also raises a lot of questions. If to pick one of those drugs, why is marijuana illegal?

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

[ QUOTE ]
"The insanity of drug prohibition is never made more stark than when viewed in the context of our culture's approach to alcohol."

This sentence is very true when viewing that graph and it also raises a lot of questions. If to pick one of those drugs, why is marijuana illegal?

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I've just found this on google so it might not be the most reliable source but an interesting read all the same

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

[ QUOTE ]
"Just because you don't prohibit something doesn't mean you're actively promoting its use."

My logic goes like this. We know that many drugs are highly addicting with a lot of negative impacts on our health and we know what that addiction can lead to. In my opinion it seems irresponsible of a society not to be against something that has this affect on us. Why leave it open for others to find out what kind of hell drugs has to offer?

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There are a lot of things which are addictive and can deteriorate your health as I mentioned before. You don't have to be for drug prohibition to be against drug use. There's education, free exchange of information, good parenting, objective data and a million other ways to let people know what risks they take. It's not illegal for me to have unprotected sex and the results could be fatal. There's tons of information out there for me to access to assess the risks and choose accordingly. I don't need society to threaten me with violence in order for me to choose wisely. A free society has risks because it has choices -- freedom means responsibility. Threatening violence to eliminate risks has shown to invariably do more harm than good.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

[ QUOTE ]
"Just because you don't prohibit something doesn't mean you're actively promoting its use."

My logic goes like this. We know that many drugs are highly addicting with a lot of negative impacts on our health and we know what that addiction can lead to. In my opinion it seems irresponsible of a society not to be against something that has this affect on us. Why leave it open for others to find out what kind of hell drugs has to offer?

[/ QUOTE ]

There isn't a choice between a world with drugs and a world without. There will be drugs, and people will use them -- mostly because it feels good. Your choice is if you want to criminalize their use and sale or not.

Look at the good and harm drugs do, look at how much you reduce their use by criminalizing them, look at the costs of criminalizing drugs. If you are a greatest good for society type of person (as your OP suggests), the decision to prohibit becomes a math problem. I think the costs of the war on drugs dwarfs the benefits, but it might be worth investigating -- if you can be persuaded by numbers.

If you are a personal freedom type of person then the idea of prohibiting the private transactions of consenting adults is absurd.

Re: How should a society deal with drugs?
 

This is the same logic they used to ban poker.

Poker is addictive.
Poker addicts do bad thing to themselves.
Poker addicts are a harm to society.
Internet poker sites are run by unscrupulous people.

I would have thought after witnessing something you love taken away from you first hand you would have an understanding for the issue. I guess what is all boils down to you people in the end is:

1) I want the things I don't like outlawed
2) I want the things I like to be legal
3) F-uck anyone elses preferences on 1 + 2.

Re: How should a sociaty deal with drugs?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
"Just because you don't prohibit something doesn't mean you're actively promoting its use."

My logic goes like this. We know that many drugs are highly addicting with a lot of negative impacts on our health and we know what that addiction can lead to. In my opinion it seems irresponsible of a society not to be against something that has this affect on us. Why leave it open for others to find out what kind of hell drugs has to offer?

[/ QUOTE ]

There are a lot of things which are addictive and can deteriorate your health as I mentioned before. You don't have to be for drug prohibition to be against drug use. There's education, free exchange of information, good parenting, objective data and a million other ways to let people know what risks they take. It's not illegal for me to have unprotected sex and the results could be fatal. There's tons of information out there for me to access to assess the risks and choose accordingly. I don't need society to threaten me with violence in order for me to choose wisely. A free society has risks because it has choices -- freedom means responsibility. Threatening violence to eliminate risks has shown to invariably do more harm than good.

[/ QUOTE ]

Very good post. (minor possible quibble question: the use of the word "invariably" in the last sentence? Overall, though, I agree with the essence of your post and think you hit on some important concepts).