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-   -   (NLTRN) Bet or Check vs Thinking Player (http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=405027)

cwar 05-16-2007 10:28 PM

(NLTRN) Bet or Check vs Thinking Player
 
This guy is 8% ROI over 2k+ matches and Im pretty sure he knows Im good from the little chat we had earlier. Ive been playing balls to the walls poker, 3betting light, attacking every limp cbetting like a mad man, floating including a double float. If he has a J on this flop he is definitely calling the flop bet. I dont know if he felts worse aces or a J seeing as he doesnt really know how crazy Ive been playing he probably just suspects it. Also Im pretty sure if I check the turn he will call a river bet with worse aces and a J on pretty much anything but a Q or a T (which he would very likely bet with the best hand).

The way I see it there pros and cons for both:
Pros for betting:
-Dont have to worry about free cards and bad cards creating tough river decisions vs villains donks (Q, T and possibly aces causing a chop)
-Stack worse aces(?)
Cons:
-Unlikely to get action unless Im beat
-Pot committed
-Lose value off hands that will pay off a river bet



Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Tournament
Blinds: t25/t50
2 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
Hero: t1840
BB: t1160

Pre-flop: (2 players) Hero is SB with A[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
<font color="#cc0000">Hero raises to t125</font>, BB calls t75 <font color="aaaaaa">(pot was t150)</font>.

Flop: A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (t250, 2 players)
BB checks, <font color="#cc0000">Hero bets t190</font>, BB calls t190 <font color="aaaaaa">(pot was t440)</font>.

Turn: K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (t630, 2 players)
BB checks, Hero

Much later... About the same history Ive stayed very aggressive villain has stepped up the aggression a bit.

Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Holdem Tournament
Blinds: t40/t80
2 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
SB: t2110
Hero: t890

Pre-flop: (2 players) Hero is BB with 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
SB calls t40 <font color="aaaaaa">(pot was t120)</font>, Hero checks.

Flop: 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (t160, 2 players)
Hero checks, <font color="#cc0000">SB bets t80</font>, Hero calls t80 <font color="aaaaaa">(pot was t240)</font>.

Turn: Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (t320, 2 players)
Hero checks, SB checks.

River: 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (t320, 2 players)
Hero checks, <font color="#cc0000">SB bets t200</font>, Hero calls t200

RicherThanRichie 05-17-2007 12:32 AM

Re: (NLTRN) Bet or Check vs Thinking Player
 
I like a check in hand 1 for basically the reasons you've stated. I plan to call a river donk bet by him and bet if he checks. (this includes possible scare cards comming)

Hand2 barring any specific reads I like it as I feel his doesn't bet a better 10 or a q very often if ever

soop 05-17-2007 11:25 AM

Re: (NLTRN) Bet or Check vs Thinking Player
 
Hand 1 - Out of curiousity why do you put him on a Q or a T most of the time? (Maybe you're thinking he wouldn't call the raise with something like J7, but could with QJ). I would be more worried about him hitting his random second pair in addition to the straight cards and thus would bet.

Hand 2 - Seems fine. There are a lot of missed draws he could have. Also he could have air but think you missed a draw.

cwar 05-17-2007 11:43 AM

Re: (NLTRN) Bet or Check vs Thinking Player
 
Q and T are terrible cards because it gives his most likely jacks that I beat the best hand (JT/QJ) and chops all aces that I beat.

MasterLJ 05-17-2007 12:18 PM

Re: (NLTRN) Bet or Check vs Thinking Player
 
In hand 1, given how you've been playing, I can't see doing anything else but betting.

Hand 2, I usually like this, but not in this case given how you've been playing. If he's any good he's not going to have air there as much as he has a thin value bet (with a hand that generally beats yours).


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