Re: Ruling needed, I feel dirty (Winstar obv)
 

AJs used to have a rule that would have awarded the pot to the guy who folded. It should probably be more widely adopted.

Re: Ruling needed, I feel dirty (Winstar obv)
 

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AJs used to have a rule that would have awarded the pot to the guy who folded. It should probably be more widely adopted.

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I disagree. If a player wants a piece at showdown, all that is required is to table the hand. Really easy, and at that point you get the full help of the dealer and the players at the table to correctly read the hand. But instead, if you opt to read your own hands and keep them s3kr3t unless you have a winner, then you pay the price for failing to read your hand correctly. And failing to see a straight on the board is failing to read your hand correctly.

On the other hand, if the player says "I'm playing the board" and then mucks, ok, I can take pity on him for having read Robert's Rules and believing they apply everywhere. He HAS read his hand, and he knows what he's playing and that his two cards are immaterial. In that case it's a matter of not knowing a specific casino's policy on that specific topic, and that's a lame way to lose a pot.

Re: Ruling needed, I feel dirty (Winstar obv)
 

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On the other hand, if the player says "I'm playing the board" and then mucks, ok, I can take pity on him for having read Robert's Rules and believing they apply everywhere. He HAS read his hand, and he knows what he's playing and that his two cards are immaterial. In that case it's a matter of not knowing a specific casino's policy on that specific topic, and that's a lame way to lose a pot.


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That rule is actually in every good set of rules I have ever seen. A lot of people read too much into it. All it means if if you are playing the board, make it clear you are playing the board, and throw your hand away because you don't know you have to show you still get your money. What it does not allow is for an experienced player to say "play the board" and muck his cards to keep from showing them.

Re: Ruling needed, I feel dirty (Winstar obv)
 

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That rule is actually in every good set of rules I have ever seen. A lot of people read too much into it. All it means if if you are playing the board, make it clear you are playing the board, and throw your hand away because you don't know you have to show you still get your money. What it does not allow is for an experienced player to say "play the board" and muck his cards to keep from showing them.

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So when this happens, if a floor is called the floor should give the player a mini quiz to determine the mental state of the player who mucked?

I can understand not wanting to penalize the ignorant player here. It seems intuitive (to a non-experienced player) that you wouldn't need to show your cards at a showdown when you play the board. But I think it needs to be either/or, not conditional based on the skill level/knowledge of the offending player.

The rule, as you stated it, seems pretty problematic.

Re: Ruling needed, I feel dirty (Winstar obv)
 

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That rule is actually in every good set of rules I have ever seen. A lot of people read too much into it. All it means if if you are playing the board, make it clear you are playing the board, and throw your hand away because you don't know you have to show you still get your money. What it does not allow is for an experienced player to say "play the board" and muck his cards to keep from showing them.

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So when this happens, if a floor is called the floor should give the player a mini quiz to determine the mental state of the player who mucked?

I can understand not wanting to penalize the ignorant player here. It seems intuitive (to a non-experienced player) that you wouldn't need to show your cards at a showdown when you play the board. But I think it needs to be either/or, not conditional based on the skill level/knowledge of the offending player.

The rule, as you stated it, seems pretty problematic.

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IN practice it isn't. Basically if someone says "screw you, I'm not showing, I'm playing the board" and forces his cards into the muck he isn't getting any of the pot. When a player says he is playing the board he knows his hand and is making a claim for the pot, the dealer should keep him from mucking his hand.

There are two principles here that need to be reconciled so anyway you write it will look funny. (1) You have to show your hand to win the pot. (2) You should never lose a pot based on a misunderstanding. People have put that little line in the rules to try to bring these together and protect a player that is unfamiliar with casino poker.

Re: Ruling needed, I feel dirty (Winstar obv)
 

I don't know about elsewhere, but most place I play in N. California,
require you to show your cards to claim any part of the pot when there is at least one caller. Claiming that you play the board and mucking your cards will lose you your part of the pot.

Re: Ruling needed, I feel dirty (Winstar obv)
 

Pretty much ANY casino you have to show both cards at showodown to be eligible for any part of the pot. If you are playing in a live casino, and don't know this, you deserve to lose your money... Period.

The cards do not matter... Playing the board doesn't matter. The fact is, it's called "SHOWdown" which means a big part of it is SHOWING the cards. If you muck your cards, you muck your right to the pot.