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-   -   i flop middle set str8 and flush draws are out. you play it (http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=558408)

hagbard celine 12-01-2007 02:41 PM

Re: i flop middle set str8 and flush draws are out. you play it
 
I'm an idiot.

You're right lev, didn't look at ham's stack. Your plan is best, IMO. Call flop. If button calls, get it in on the turn, otherwise look to bet the turn and get it in on the river.

Sherman 12-01-2007 02:50 PM

Re: i flop middle set str8 and flush draws are out. you play it
 
LOL. A min-raise might be fun (i.e. not as horrid as usual). It compels the button to fold even if he has a flush draw b/c he doesn't want to get caught between you and the original bettor in a raising war.

The original bettor will probably be compelled to call with anything that he bet with b/c of the pot odds. Of course he might get pissed and shove which is obv. ideal. If he just calls, he is becoming increasingly more committed to the pot and you have increased the likelihood of getting him in by the river.

LOL min-raiseaments.

Sherman

hagbard celine 12-01-2007 03:04 PM

Re: i flop middle set str8 and flush draws are out. you play it
 
[ QUOTE ]
LOL. A min-raise might be fun

[/ QUOTE ]

Sherm, you smokin' sherm?!?

Don't you see where I'm from, dawg?!?! I'll buss a cap up in yo ass!

hamnegger 12-01-2007 03:05 PM

Re: i flop middle set str8 and flush draws are out. you play it
 
i really thought raisers c-bet was weak and small. so he has maybe an underpair or gut shot. im NOT afriad of a gut shot especially when i can redraw. no flat calling is definitely the best option because the button is my best chance of doubling through. by calling im saying i have a little something and so button now may say hey i can steal this pot or hehas to raise if he really does have a hand. once he raises ive got him bc any man sized raise committs him to call my shove. if he flat calls ill value bet the turn and river. as played he raised utg folded (i knew he was weak) and i shoved and won the maximum. when i hit a set i want to win the max i really don't care about draws sucking out if they do god bless them.

Sherman 12-01-2007 04:24 PM

Re: i flop middle set str8 and flush draws are out. you play it
 
So you "knew" button was going to raise you. WTF. Sure you line is optimal if you know that button is going to raise. But how do you know button is going to raise? He was getting great odds in position PF to call. He could have any number of cards here.

This just seems really results oriented to me. If you flat call and he calls and the turn brings a flush card, UTG checks, you bet and button shoves (a pretty realistic result) you wouldn't be posting this.

Sherman

J.A.K. 12-01-2007 06:50 PM

Re: i flop middle set str8 and flush draws are out. you play it
 
I've gotten myself into trouble eking out extra value on coordinated boards with my sets. But this is against a single villain. With more than one opponent and this flop, I call here 0% of the time. Adding 30% to your starting stack is a good thing. I'm probably just overbet shoving the flop.

black666 12-01-2007 07:40 PM

Re: i flop middle set str8 and flush draws are out. you play it
 
Raise PF.
Raise flop.

What kind of buy-in is this from?

hamnegger 12-01-2007 08:06 PM

Re: i flop middle set str8 and flush draws are out. you play it
 
i really really hope all these people who keep saying reraise preflop read this. because i completely disagree. the raiser is utg we have to give him credit for a strong hand. he knows this so a reraise allows him to play perfect poker. if he has a hand worse than jj he folds. perhaps ace q is only hand a raise is good against and folds. if he has jacks beat we are cooked and if he has ak he sees 5 cards. my positional advantage is gone. i love you 3 betting guys w jj w 30bb+ bc when i raise utg w kings you give me all your chips. and sherman i don't KNOW he is going to raise but i think there is a good chance he will.if he hits a flush (rare so rare i don't even worry about it) he will either win all my chips or i will fill up. the 4 flusher w an over card SHOULD RAISE given this action before him anyway. I WANT THAT. ill take better than 2:1 on my $$$ anyday. sherman this would all change if stacks were big

black666 12-01-2007 08:25 PM

Re: i flop middle set str8 and flush draws are out. you play it
 
1. please hit the "enter" key at least 2 or 3 times in your posts
2. you haven't answered my question about the buyin.

You have the 4th best hand in poker, so why not 3-bet in position? You can't always see monsters under the bed (KK). I've seen people call or shove behind you with A-rag and 55+

[ QUOTE ]
i love you 3 betting guys w jj w 30bb+ bc when i raise utg w kings you give me all your chips.

[/ QUOTE ]

Guess what .. I love you guys flat calling with JJ when I'm holding a suited connector on the button or in the blinds. You allow me to see a cheap flop and give me all your chips once I flop a monster.

The whole reason for the PF 3-bet is to isolate the UTG villain. Once you call you are inviting everyone to join the family pot. You can consider yourself lucky that both blinds folded after the button called.

hamnegger 12-01-2007 09:00 PM

Re: i flop middle set str8 and flush draws are out. you play it
 
[ QUOTE ]
1. please hit the "enter" key at least 2 or 3 times in your posts
2. you haven't answered my question about the buyin.

You have the 4th best hand in poker, so why not 3-bet in position? You can't always see monsters under the bed (KK). I've seen people call or shove behind you with A-rag and 55+

[ QUOTE ]
i love you 3 betting guys w jj w 30bb+ bc when i raise utg w kings you give me all your chips.

[/ QUOTE ]

Guess what .. I love you guys flat calling with JJ when I'm holding a suited connector on the button or in the blinds. You allow me to see a cheap flop and give me all your chips once I flop a monster.



[/ QUOTE ]


1. yes i should hit enter

2. 50 buy in

3 we agree to disagree gl which is good bc not everybody should play the same it would be friggin boring


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