flop decision
 

i think preflop is a fold for BB but ignore that please. just interested in his flop play. SB structure is 2/3.

Absolute Poker
Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $3/$6
6 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is a 28/20/2 good TAG in the hijack.
UTG folds, <font color="#cc0000">Hero raises</font>, 2 folds, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (6SB, 3 players)
<font color="#cc0000">SB bets</font>..

what should BB do with J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]? no read on SB.

Re: flop decision
 

I think it is easy fold.



Dave

Re: flop decision
 

Seems like it should be a fold.

Could be a raise depending upon BB's view of Hero as a raiser, but considering hero will rarely just release to a raise, the cost of fighting over the pot will be vary high.

Plus almost every card in the deck is going to make j8o worse.

Re: flop decision
 

oh and simply because i don't want to sound like a giant toolbag calling myself "good," the hijack/hero in this hand is not me.

Re: flop decision
 

I dont like raising at all. The TAG cant profitably peel here with much and if he can, raising probably wont fold him out. The more I think about it, the more I like folding due to bad RIO.

Re: flop decision
 

I think SB's bet is most likely either a flopped monster, or a flush draw possibly with a pair. I get the feeling this isn't red Jx much.

I think it's between call and reevaluate or fold. I would've called but looking at the others comments and then running a rough likely inaccurate stove, folding might be best.

Re: flop decision
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think SB's bet is most likely either a flopped monster, or a flush draw possibly with a pair. I get the feeling this isn't red Jx much.

I think it's between call and reevaluate or fold. I would've called but looking at the others comments and then running a rough likely inaccurate stove, folding might be best.

[/ QUOTE ]

WTF fold? I never fold in that spot. Flop donk is marginal made hands and flush draws more often than a monster.

I dont raise either BTW. Call and reevaluate. Raising most safe turns

Re: flop decision
 

raise

are you doing this for a student?

Re: flop decision
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think SB's bet is most likely either a flopped monster, or a flush draw possibly with a pair. I get the feeling this isn't red Jx much.

I think it's between call and reevaluate or fold. I would've called but looking at the others comments and then running a rough likely inaccurate stove, folding might be best.


[/ QUOTE ]

WTF fold? I never fold in that spot. Flop donk is marginal made hands and flush draws more often than a monster.

I dont raise either BTW. Call and reevaluate. Raising most safe turns

[/ QUOTE ]

I never do either, I guess the other posts influenced me, plus running a stove without really discounting monsters, I agree too many donks don't donk their monsters.

Re: flop decision
 

May be a fold but it's not really an easy one. If you continue, I'm not really sure. If the PFR is good and is unpaired and without a flush draw he basically has to be mucking. It would definitely be a coup to raise and get him off A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] and have the SB show up with red A6, but I just feel like this is too big of a parlay. That is, almost always SB a) already has you beat or b) a club will win it for him, so raising might not be best.

The thing with calling is that if the PFR also calls, wth do you do on the turn. He could easily be waiting with a overpair without a flush draw or FSD raise red tens (because that's just what people do these days) and you're in a weird spot.

Tough hand.

Re: flop decision
 

[ QUOTE ]
I think it is easy fold.



Dave

[/ QUOTE ]


Miss read sorry

Re: flop decision
 

As I think more about this hand I don't think it is a bad fold at all on the flop. More often than not the SB's bet either has you beat or he has the big club. That being said now you still have the Hijack left to act and God knows what that brings. You might seem like a weak/tighty but I would get out with the 1/2BB mistake of calling preflop. I don't see how you turn this hand into a 1/2BB+ profit from this point on.


Dave

Re: flop decision
 

I would fold this.

Re: flop decision
 

I've seen enough Ac and Kc draws here so I'm calling.

Re: flop decision
 

I almost always fold here but it's not uncommon to find myself shouting at the computer at showdown "what? you b*tch!"

Re: flop decision
 

tbh I would have raised here on autopilot, but this post has got me thinking

Re: flop decision
 

I don't fold this preflop and I don't fold this flop. Whether I raise or not really depends on more than stats here though, of course.

Re: flop decision
 

[ QUOTE ]
I don't fold this preflop and I don't fold this flop. Whether I raise or not really depends on more than stats here though, of course.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're raising this pre-flop by default?

Re: flop decision
 

[ QUOTE ]
oh and simply because i don't want to sound like a giant toolbag calling myself "good," the hijack/hero in this hand is not me.

[/ QUOTE ]

lol

Re: flop decision
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I don't fold this preflop and I don't fold this flop. Whether I raise or not really depends on more than stats here though, of course.

[/ QUOTE ]

You're raising this pre-flop by default?

[/ QUOTE ]

You read the action wrong. BB defended with J8o 3-ways, and the question is what he should do here, trapped in the middle.

Rob

Re: flop decision
 

I think i'd just call and re evaluate and i'd call pre flop as well

Re: flop decision
 

guys.is any of u wining players?
if bb calls raise and get top pair and anyway must fold,
so whay he at all in this pot
he must at least call and maybe raise,
no way i fold here...

Re: flop decision
 

I call and raise a safe turncard. Do you fold if the turn is a A or K and sb bets again?

Re: flop decision
 

probably if A comes not K,sb beting so he have good made hand or good drow,probably A flush drow,so call him down in turn if things not get very nesty,i mean preflop raiser raise turn...

Re: flop decision
 

Don't hate the defense. I usually call and see what happens. I might raise depending on who is doing the donking. Or rarely fold.

Re: flop decision
 

i thought it was a call. depending on the turn card i'm mostly just calling the turn as well with no read on the donker.

i don't think the TAG behind us is one to wait here with a good hand so i think if he raises we can just check fold the turn to him 3-way on a rag (obviously on a club if he bets).

i just disagreed with people that it was a flop raise. there are only a few hands that incorrectly fold to a raise. KoQ[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] and Ao[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] get out on the flop to a raise, but i don't think they overcall the turn again if we just call.

some other people were adamant about a flop raise. i just wanted to see.