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-   -   Is this a donk move? (http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=512273)

chucky 09-30-2007 03:53 AM

Is this a donk move?
 
I figured the pot would stay multiway until 5th so i called on 4th. Villian berated my play as donkish. Was it?
This is a low buyin stud tourney.
Tournament - 7 Card Stud High - Level IV (60/120), Ante 12, Bring-In 18 (converter)

Seat 1: 2,854
Seat 2: 1,271
Hero: 836
Seat 4: 3,107
Seat 5: 1,103
Seat 6: 1,401
Seat 7: 1,696
Seat 8: 612

3rd Street - (1.60 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 2: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___raises
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___brings-in___calls
Seat 4: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___calls___calls
Seat 5: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___calls___calls
Seat 6: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___calls___calls
Seat 7: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 8: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds

4th Street - (6.60 SB)

Seat 2: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___bets
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 4: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___checks___calls
Seat 5: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___checks___calls
Seat 6: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___checks___calls

5th Street - (5.80 BB)

Seat 2: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___bets
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 4: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___checks___folds
Seat 5: xx xx 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___checks___folds
Seat 6: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___checks___calls

6th Street - (8.80 BB)

Seat 2: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___bets
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 6: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls

River - (11.80 BB)

Seat 2: xx xx A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] xx___bets___calls
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___raises
Seat 6: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] xx___folds

Total pot: (15.80 BB)

RandomUser 09-30-2007 09:34 AM

Re: Is this a donk move?
 
Nothing wrong with it due to the number of people in the pot on 3rd.

With 5 people calling the raise on 3rd and 5 calling the bet on 4th, you easily have odds to call, even if villain has Aces up on 4th or 5th.

Andy B 09-30-2007 02:06 PM

Re: Is this a donk move?
 
People who go around lecturing their opponents in low buy-in tournaments frequently don't know what the hell they're talking about. Here diamonds are very live, and the bettor's hand is a little dead. I can see two reasons for you not to call:

1. There is the risk of a check-raise, which you would hate. I'm guessing that that isn't too great a risk in this event.

2. That T60 represents a decent chunk of your stack, and you will frequently have to fold fifth.

In a cash game, especially a passive one, this is a pretty easy call. I think I call in your spot too, but I think it's pretty close. It's hardly donkish.

roggles 09-30-2007 03:22 PM

Re: Is this a donk move?
 
Is it relevant that since there are many people in the pot you can hit a flush draw that is much stronger than if you were heads up for example?

I don't know, I'm actually asking. I'm more thinking in context of cash game, because I don't play tourneys [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

chucky 09-30-2007 05:42 PM

Re: Is this a donk move?
 
Its relevant because low limit tourneys depend on multiway pots. I dislike going for bare flush draws in HU scenarios.

RustyBrooks 09-30-2007 06:50 PM

Re: Is this a donk move?
 
[ QUOTE ]
Is it relevant that since there are many people in the pot you can hit a flush draw that is much stronger than if you were heads up for example?

I don't know, I'm actually asking. I'm more thinking in context of cash game, because I don't play tourneys [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

If you make your K high flush, you have a very good chance of winning, even multi-way. If the hand is multiway, then you'll win a larger pot, so you can take a larger risk. The other players are, in a sense, helping you pay for your draw.

The Worm 09-30-2007 07:57 PM

Re: Is this a donk move?
 
Donk move was the Ace raising last and pricing all the draws into the hand. I tend to just call there, keep the pot small and conceal my hand a little bit. Thats just me.

dsaxton 10-01-2007 01:19 PM

Re: Is this a donk move?
 
I think this is the only way to play it. On 5th, if the bettor were to your immediate left, the correct play in a freezeout tournament is probably to raise and attempt to get all-in given your stack size, but since the rest of the field is left to act after you, I would just call as you did.

blumpkin 10-01-2007 04:41 PM

Re: Is this a donk move?
 
the call on 4th is extremely marginal. the default play should be to fold here.

electrical 10-01-2007 07:12 PM

Re: Is this a donk move?
 
A play nobody has mentioned is raising Four.

You will probably be heads-up and in position on the Ace from here out, unless you catch an Ace card or pair in-sight, which would probably allow you to take the pot on the next card. You may also catch a Diamond or make a pair, both of which would be nice, and would allow you to take a free one if you thought you needed it.

It isn't something you'd do all the time, but with a bunch of low un-threatening boards behind you, and nobody displaying much interest in the pot, this is a good time for it because you won't lose position unless you improve (or appear to improve) your hand.


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