Live Etiquette - Line Check
 

I play at Riverside Casino, south of Iowa City Iowa a lot. I'd love any feedback on teh following:

1) The poker room has a lower rake (3+1) for six-handed or shorter. At least 6 times in the past two weeks, I've caught dealers over-raking the pots (taking the usual 4+1) in short-handed games. I don't pay attention every hand or anything, and I actually try to remind the dealers about the short rake when the game gets reduced. Every time it's happened, I called the dealer out on the hand in question, tried to explain to them that an extra dollar really is a big deal, even for people experiencing thousand-dollar swings, and advise the floor at the end of the evening that I've caught another one.

One time, after I've caught a dealer doing it twice in one down, I've called the floor to the table to explain to the dealer how short-handed rake was supposed to work (I then tipped the dealer a couple extra bucks for the down -- no hard fealings). I think the floor thought I was being ridiculous, maybe I was.

Thoughts on how I've handled this? (FYI, this is a room where you are NOT required to request a reduced rake, it's supposed to be automatic.)

2) Last night I'm playing 2-5, and squeeze 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. Nitbag with $400 (I cover) makes it $25. Decent player calls, I call behind (in position). Flop comes 4 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]7 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. "Woohoo! Pair and a double gutter!" I think (for those of you playing at home, this makes me an idiot).

Nit bets $80, aggro guy raises all in to $190 total. Aggro guy only does this with a draw, and I've got made hand + a draw (I think). ALL-INNN!! for $410 effective. Nit deliberates, than calls with his obvious overpair (oh well). I say, "nice call, I've just got a big draw". Aggrow guy turns over 56 and says "me too". I say (not an angle-shoot, I seriously was not thinking) "I've got the same hand!" and call for a 3 or 8. When the 3 spikes on the river, nit curses and mucks his hand (after flashing it to the guy next to him). I table my . . . 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]7 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] for a lonely pair of sevens and the worst-played hand in the history of poker!!!

Dealer starts shipping me the ~$400 side pot and ships the main pot to aggro guy. Some commotion ensues, but the nit takes it surprisingly well, except everyone at the table decides to explain to him sixteen thousand times "that's why you always gotta protect your hand." I make it clear I'm not proud of winning a pot that way, and let it go until a little later when I've booked a decent win. I hand the guy who screwed himself over a hundred, told him "that's more than anyone else here would do" and "I woulda chopped the pot, but I didn't actually win anything in it." He seemed okay with that (if not a bit subdued).

Was this overly nice, B&M?

Feel free to use this thread to ask me any questions about Riverside near Iowa City, which I think has been horribly mis-managed from day 1.

Re: Live Etiquette - Line Check
 

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1) ....., I've caught dealers over-raking the pots (taking the usual 4+1) in short-handed games....
Thoughts on how I've handled this?


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Dealers go on automatic after awhile and sometimes fail to notice/remember the game is short. Not like they get more money the more they drop.
Watch, remind, rinse, repeat.

Only if the dealer gets huffy ("It's only a dollar!") do I go into a dissertation about how the additional $1 rake compares to the $1 tip she won't be getting from me.

Re: Live Etiquette - Line Check
 

You are a moran, not an [censored]-hole. Congratulations.





My point is that it was clearly accidental and not an angle shoot, so it wasn't terrible. It was nice of you to drop him a cnote later. $0.02




I'd keep bugging the floor about the rake until they pound it into the dealers when to reduce the drop. Its only a buck at a time, yes, but its just wrong for them to take it.

Re: Live Etiquette - Line Check
 

I'd say three mistakes were made here, from least to worst (discounting what seems to be rather bizarre betting by both you and the OESD player, but I don't play NL much so can't really comment):

1 - you misreading your hand

2 - overpair folding without seeing a hand that beats him for part of the pot

3 - you giving away $100 for nothing

Re: Live Etiquette - Line Check
 

[ QUOTE ]
I'd say three mistakes were made here, from least to worst (discounting what seems to be rather bizarre betting by both you and the OESD player, but I don't play NL much so can't really comment):

1 - you misreading your hand

2 - overpair folding without seeing a hand that beats him for part of the pot

3 - you giving away $100 for nothing

[/ QUOTE ]

Hmmmm . . . the betting makes sense, considering we both knew we were against someone who folds overpairs A LOT there (especially given that the hand I thought I had could catch 13 cards twice to take over big pairs).

I'd like to know WHY you think it was such a clearly big mistake to pass off the bill considering he obviously made an honest mistake. I'm in poker to make money, but I've never lost money by being in his shoes (and I am not likely to, I protect my hand) so it's not like the "it balances out in the end" argument comes into play.

At what point should I consider factors like:

* I play in this room a lot.
* So does the other guy.

Re: Live Etiquette - Line Check
 

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Only if the dealer gets huffy ("It's only a dollar!") do I go into a dissertation about how the additional $1 rake compares to the $1 tip she won't be getting from me.

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That's one of the big problesm at Riverside, dealers share their tips, not only with other poker room dealers, but with ALL FLOOR dealers in the casinos. Leads to some pretty slow dealing, but the dealers are typically (surprisingly) competent.

Re: Live Etiquette - Line Check
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'd say three mistakes were made here, from least to worst (discounting what seems to be rather bizarre betting by both you and the OESD player, but I don't play NL much so can't really comment):

1 - you misreading your hand

2 - overpair folding without seeing a hand that beats him for part of the pot

3 - you giving away $100 for nothing

[/ QUOTE ]

Hmmmm . . . the betting makes sense, considering we both knew we were against someone who folds overpairs A LOT there (especially given that the hand I thought I had could catch 13 cards twice to take over big pairs).

I'd like to know WHY you think it was such a clearly big mistake to pass off the bill considering he obviously made an honest mistake. I'm in poker to make money, but I've never lost money by being in his shoes (and I am not likely to, I protect my hand) so it's not like the "it balances out in the end" argument comes into play.

At what point should I consider factors like:

* I play in this room a lot.
* So does the other guy.

[/ QUOTE ]

You won the side pot because you mis-called your hand (by accident). Later, you partially made up for it and earned some goodwill, or at least less ill will.

I'm not seeing the problem here.

Re: Live Etiquette - Line Check
 

If it can be verified that nit actually had an overpair i would apologize for my mistake and ship him the whole side pot. You miscalled your hand which caused him to muck a winning hand. Of course you don't have to but i think it's the right thing to do.

Re: Live Etiquette - Line Check
 

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You won the side pot because you mis-called your hand (by accident). Later, you partially made up for it and earned some goodwill, or at least less ill will.

I'm not seeing the problem here.


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the problem i see is the word "partially"

Re: Live Etiquette - Line Check
 

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The poker room has a lower rake (3+1) for six-handed or shorter. At least 6 times in the past two weeks, I've caught dealers over-raking the pots (taking the usual 4+1) in short-handed games.

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Can someone explain what 3+1 and 4+1 mean? Where I play it's 10% to $6 max, no reduction for playing short-handed.