Do you always give them credit?
 

Full Tilt Poker, $0.25/$0.50 Limit Hold'em Cash Game, 8 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

Pre-Flop: J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] dealt to Hero (BTN)
2 folds, MP1 calls, 2 folds, <font color="red">Hero raises</font>, SB calls, BB folds, MP1 calls

Flop: (7 SB) J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (3 Players)
SB checks, MP1 checks, <font color="red">Hero bets</font>, SB calls, MP1 calls

Turn: (5 BB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (3 Players)
SB checks, MP1 checks, <font color="red">Hero bets</font>, SB folds, <font color="red">MP1 raises</font>, Hero ???

MP1 has been playing pretty loose/passive, but can we really give him credit for the flush here? Surely if we fold here we are asking for everyone and their dog to bet into us when the third flush card falls?

I may have also been influenced by the fact I had been bashed a few hands in a row at this point, and was thinking "Surely it hasn't happened again?"

Re: Do you always give them credit?
 

as long as you don't fold it's okay either way. you realize mathwise even if he turns his flush faceup on the table you have to call right?

Re: Do you always give them credit?
 

Call-down, in addition to the flush, 87 just got a straight.

He could have been slowplaying a lower set too, some of the time, or hit 99, or J9 but if a passive player raises I just call-down here without more accurate reads.

Re: Do you always give them credit?
 

folding would be very bad. OP, can you tell me why?

Re: Do you always give them credit?
 

You have 10 outs, like BBB said even if he showed you his flush you need to call. if you fill up on the river, you can C/R the crap out of him.

Re: Do you always give them credit?
 

Grunch:

Call it down you still have outs for the full house then you can win a huge pot when the board pairs or you get quads.

Re: Do you always give them credit?
 

That old maxim "never fold a set before the river" applies here without a doubt. You have 10 outs if you're behind, folding is awful.

Re: Do you always give them credit?
 

Never fold this. I wouldn't be adverse to a three bet either because we have position and a lot of outs if we are behind. If you have been bashed recently calling down is a solid low variance approach to this spot but you may miss value against aggressive villains.

Re: Do you always give them credit?
 

Others have stated the obvious about your hand strength and outs, but I want to add this:

[ QUOTE ]

MP1 has been playing pretty loose/passive, but can we really give him credit for the flush here? Surely if we fold here we are asking for everyone and their dog to bet into us when the third flush card falls?


[/ QUOTE ]

1&gt; I think the bolded bit is giving microstakes players in general too much credit.

2&gt; If the bolded part were true, wouldn't it be a good thing for you if people bluffed into you when scare cards hit?

Re: Do you always give them credit?
 

Man seeing a lot of hands like this today.

I just had a cap preflop hand with 66 against a bad player , the flop comes 2,4,5 I call his 3 bet, turn is a 6 and he 3 bets again.

He can't have a 3? I cap he leads the river and I call down with my missed full house as he shows 23o .

When crap happens it happens.

Re: Do you always give them credit?
 

G

You must call here and hate it. And you must call the river. Feel free to try and get max value out of your opponent when the board pairs [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

Re: Do you always give them credit?
 

[ QUOTE ]


He can't have a 3? I cap he leads the river and I call down with my missed full house as he shows 23o .



[/ QUOTE ]

I just call that turn instead of capping, and check / call the river brick. Seems like I get shown A3 a lot there. With four to the straight on the board I just don't see most villains three-betting without the goods.

Re: Do you always give them credit?
 

You can't really think that way however, it happens sure but time and again I have been bluffed reraised on every street by some guys. You just have to know what they are capable of and bet for value.

I still had ten outs if he did have the 3 and by capping I set myself up to get another 3 out of him if I hit it and that is if he does have the 3.

Re: Do you always give them credit?
 

Yes, you need to stay in. Even if you're beat now, you have ten outs to improve.

Re: Do you always give them credit?
 

Thanks to everyone for replying - really solid thoughts. I do have to call, and as has been pointed out it's because the pot is large enough for me to call with my ten outs - or I could even be ahead. Good times.

I especially liked the poster who suggested I _want_ people bluffing into me like this. I'm starting to realise this is exactly what I want.

Thanks again.

Re: Do you always give them credit?
 

call the turn raise...............then raise the roof after you make your full house on the river!!!!!!!!!!!