25PLO AAxx got myself in a bit of bother
 

Reads on villain are that he has reraised me twice and I've folded marginal hands. He also called an all in on the flop with a butt naked over-pair about 8 hands before this.

Comments about any street welcome. [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img] This is my first post outside of the Golf forum, so hello all. I'm a poker novice been playing about 3 months, and Omaha for about a month.


PokerStars Game #11548136760: Omaha Pot Limit ($0.10/$0.25) - 2007/08/18 - 00:59:48 (ET)
Table 'Propus II' 9-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: Jbird831 ($38.50 in chips)
Seat 2: richard-shu ($20.15 in chips)
Seat 3: joop1932 ($41 in chips)
Seat 4: amsmls169 ($26.45 in chips)
Seat 5: Grand Foobar ($32.45 in chips)
Seat 6: leotaq ($66.05 in chips)
Seat 7: iron81 ($25 in chips)
Seat 8: Omenathor ($38.30 in chips)
Seat 9: GyroMartinez ($20.35 in chips)
joop1932: posts small blind $0.10
amsmls169: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to GyroMartinez [Ah Ad 2s Jc]
Grand Foobar: calls $0.25
leotaq: folds
iron81: folds
Omenathor: raises $0.50 to $0.75
GyroMartinez: calls $0.75
Jbird831: folds
richard-shu: folds
joop1932: folds
amsmls169: calls $0.50
Grand Foobar: calls $0.50
*** FLOP *** [6h 9c Js]
amsmls169: checks
Grand Foobar: checks
Omenathor: bets $1.25
GyroMartinez: calls $1.25
amsmls169: folds
Grand Foobar: calls $1.25
*** TURN *** [6h 9c Js] [As]
Grand Foobar: checks
Omenathor: checks
GyroMartinez: bets $6.55
Grand Foobar: folds
Omenathor: calls $6.55
*** RIVER *** [6h 9c Js As] [8h]
Omenathor: bets $9.25

Re: 25PLO AAxx got myself in a bit of bother
 

In the future you might want to use a converter to hide who you are. I fold the flop. You have overpair without any draws against someone who is betting his straight draw. If you do raise here you can represent ttp or set, but be prepared to fold to many shoves. You are folding this river 95% of the time unless you have seen him bluff on river before.

Re: 25PLO AAxx got myself in a bit of bother
 

I can see the fold on the river (I wish I had done), but isn't folding the flop here a bit nitty?

Re: 25PLO AAxx got myself in a bit of bother
 

for me hand plays easier if you 3 bet preflop. that way you take the initiative and can lead for like 3/4 pot when its checked to you and its also an easier fold if he leads into you on the flop or C/R's you. also if he flat calls you can get more of your stack in on that great turn card so the river decision isnt AS difficult.

edit: as played i fold this and reload.

Re: 25PLO AAxx got myself in a bit of bother
 

The thing is while we have a made hand on the flop (pair of aces) we can not play our made hand aggressively because it has weak showdown value. What happens if we don't hit an ace on the turn, and our opponent bets when the straight isnt out there. teh minbet poker wrote that you should 3 bet aces preflop. Frankly these aces are so weak that you shouldnt 3 bet them unless you 3 bet a wide range of hands and feel very comfortable with postflop play.

Re: 25PLO AAxx got myself in a bit of bother
 

[ QUOTE ]
The thing is while we have a made hand on the flop (pair of aces) we can not play our made hand aggressively because it has weak showdown value. What happens if we don't hit an ace on the turn, and our opponent bets when the straight isnt out there. teh minbet poker wrote that you should 3 bet aces preflop. Frankly these aces are so weak that you shouldnt 3 bet them unless you 3 bet a wide range of hands and feel very comfortable with postflop play.

[/ QUOTE ]

i agree with this...my opinion is, that if the OP feels comfortable enough to peel off a card on the flop in this situation he should feel comfortable 3betting this hand(and a lot of other hands).

so i guess OP can either fold this flop more often or begin to open up his range and be more aggressive preflop.

Re: 25PLO AAxx got myself in a bit of bother
 

Thanks for posting those thoughts. I knew it was a dodgy hand, played poorly, right down to the finish.

Omenathor: bets $9.25
GyroMartinez: raises $2.55 to $11.80 and is all-in
Omenathor: calls $2.55
*** SHOW DOWN ***
GyroMartinez: shows [Ah Ad 2s Jc] (three of a kind, Aces)
Omenathor: shows [Kd Jd Th Qs] (a straight, Eight to Queen)
Omenathor collected $41.45 from pot

Re: 25PLO AAxx got myself in a bit of bother
 

[ QUOTE ]
but isn't folding the flop here a bit nitty?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, way to many things can happen and you are never a big favorite here if you even are. Also, opponent described is going to bet a lot making turn very hard unless you hit your A.

Re: 25PLO AAxx got myself in a bit of bother
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
but isn't folding the flop here a bit nitty?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, way to many things can happen and you are never a big favorite here if you even are. Also, opponent described is going to bet a lot making turn very hard unless you hit your A.

[/ QUOTE ]
I think I'm beginning to get the concept of showdown value. Very few people fold straight/flush draws even with no odds to call(at these low levels). This hand he's 65/35 dog on turn but I paid him off so he definitely got value. Looks like I have a lot to learn.

Re: 25PLO AAxx got myself in a bit of bother
 

Full ring, four handed to the flop this is an insta-fold. What turn card besides an ace do you want to see? This guy is a slight favorite to you on the flop and with the range of hands he could of had he could of been a huge favorite. For example sometihng like J-10-9-8 has you dominated 80-20. The river is also a standard fold.

I wouldnt reraise the flop either with crappy aces like that. Full ring at these stakes will get you a bunch of callers preflop even to a 3bet and unless you hit an ace you cant really go anywhere with this hand. In full ring omaha your really need to play tight looking for premium hands with draws to the nuts. I would try shorthanded if that isnt your style.