2 Live 8/16 Kill hands
 

Thought I would post a couple hands from yesterday's session.

8/16 Kill (kill is on playing 16/32)

Hero is in the cut-off with T [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], two limpers, hero calls, button folds, LAG SB Raises, BB folds, killer calls, all call. (10 SB)

Flop Q [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

SB Bets, killer folds, MP calls and is all in, hero calls (?) (6.5 BB)

Turn 9 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

SB Bets, hero raises, SB calls. (10.5 BB)

River 7 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

SB checks hero checks (?!?!?)

Hand #2 8/16 Kill, (kill is on 16/32)

Hero in BB with K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], two ep limpers, hero calls kill, killer checks (4 SB)

Flop K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 2 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

Hero bets, two fold to TAG on button who raies, hero 3 bets, button calls. (5 BB)

Turn A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]

Hero bets, button raises, hero calls. (9 BB)

River 8 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Hero checks, button bets hero folds (?)

Hand #3 8/16 Kill (kill is on playing 16/32)

Hero is in BB with K [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

3 limpers, hero calls the kill, SB who is a tricky solid player (killer) checks (5 SB)

Flop: 6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

SB checks, hero bets, all fold to SB who calls 9 (3.5 BB)

Turn J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

SB checks, hero bets, SB calls (5.5 BB)

River A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

SB Bets, hero???

My overall feeling is that I get too weak-tight on the big streets when the kill is on. I like the 8/16 game at my local casino as I feel like I am actually playing for something instead of playing 3/6 which honestly boars me and I don't play as well as I do at the higher game. I like to play tight agressive but feel like I get scared way too easily on the kill hands. Any and all advice is appreciated. Thx.

Re: 2 Live 8/16 Kill hands
 

hand 1: raise pf. bet the river. rest fine.

hand 2: vs a TAG, dont bet the turn, i dont see any worse hand that can call you. QTs or JTs maybe but those dont make up the majority of his range and have only 3 outs vs you anyway. c/c the turn and if he's fit/fold type c/f river UI.

hand 3: raise pf. raise river.
rest fine.

EDIT:

OP, I'm going to give you some pieces of advice to consider.

1) always raise suited broadway cards PF after limpers have entered the pot before you. this inclues JTs and KTs.

2) if you the turn card almost definitely helps your opponent and/or makes it impossible for him to call with a worse hand, AND if you cant possibly fold to a raise (like the K5 hand), consider taking a passive line.

3) if you can think of more than 2 worse hands that your opponent will call you with in less than 2 seconds, bet the river.

Re: 2 Live 8/16 Kill hands
 

Grrrrunch.



Hand 1: JTs is a hand your can raise with or not PF - but in late position, it's not a bad hand to raise with - EV wise it's stronger than KQo or A9s.

This hand was played fine until the river. BET THE RIVER. You missed a good value bet here.



Hand 2: PF okay

Flop: I like betting out, but I don't like the 3 bet here. It's not for value against a tag. You are out kicked, or drawing only to your flush.

Turn: check/call after being raised by the tag

River: I'm probably making a check/crying call here, especially HU in a live game.



Hand 3:

PF: RAISE.

Flop: Okay (I like betting the flop here for deception/semi-bluff)

Turn: Okay

River: Hmmm... that's weird. If he made the nut flush on the turn, he'd check raise for certain. His turn check/call means to me, no flush. But then he bets out on the river.

He's probably not that afraid that you have a flush, because you bet out the flop. Really, A4 or is the only thing I see *in his range based on his action* that beats you. He might bet here with any other Ax, or possibly with 4x, wanting to get value and afraid you'll check behind - but since you say he's solid, I'm probably just calling here much of the time. This is VERY read dependent. There are many players that I will definitely raise here.

AB

Re: 2 Live 8/16 Kill hands
 

I have questions about raising hands like JTs. Is it because when you hit the flop, you will get more action from players that think you are just cbetting with overcards? Is it to widen your raising range so players are more likely to call your raises with weak hands? Do these hands really win often enough that this raise is +EV on its own?

Re: 2 Live 8/16 Kill hands
 

[ QUOTE ]
I have questions about raising hands like JTs. Is it because when you hit the flop, you will get more action from players that think you are just cbetting with overcards? Is it to widen your raising range so players are more likely to call your raises with weak hands? Do these hands really win often enough that this raise is +EV on its own?

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the answers to these questions are yes, yes and yes.

Re: 2 Live 8/16 Kill hands
 

raising pre-flop is not an automatic in the first hand if the killer is prone to defending their kill option. in a non-kill game there is no question its a very easy raise, but in a kill game the killer's tendencies should be considered first before committing to the raise.

I often raise anyway because I LOVE big pots, but it is a consideration every time when the killer is last to act.

Re: 2 Live 8/16 Kill hands
 

Hand 1: Bet river
Hand 2: Fold
Hand 3: Raise river