Cash Game Problems
 

Okay, no doubt you've seen this question a hundred times before, so apologies.

I want to improve at cash games, yet find that my cash game style doesn't particularly serve me well. I'm pretty successful in tourneys, and decided recently to devote my time to these, but I'm sure that being able to beat cash games is the key to being an 'improving' player.

I play 5c-10c, or 10c-25c on Stars, and have built a bankroll from $50 up to $400 in six months or so, although most of my profit has come from Tournaments. I haven't had a win over $40 in that time, so I consider myself a consistent winning player overall. I don't have PokerTracker yet, so I can't provide stats. The thing is, I don't generally lose at cash games, I win a little or lose a little. In Tournaments I have the confidence to try to control a table, and often do so successfully, however in cash games I go into my shell, waiting for good starting hands, folding to re-raises unless I have the nuts etc etc.

My questions are, anyone else here encountered similar problems? How did you overcome them? What did you change about your game, and what are the fundamental differences between Cash and Tourney in your opinion?

I realise these are pretty basic questions, and I don't necessarily consider myself a limited player, but I think some feedback would help.

Thanks in advance.

Re: Cash Game Problems
 

[ QUOTE ]
what are the fundamental differences between Cash and Tourney in your opinion?

[/ QUOTE ]

Deeper stacks. Ability to top up (which you should do a lot). Greatly reduced time pressure (if you wait all day for Aces you might not cover what you lost in blinds, but it's nowhere near as bad as in a tournament).

Re: Cash Game Problems
 

All of these things can be fixed if you just start participating in the forums:

Posting hand histores

Responding to hand histories

Reading the stickies

I really don't understand what you want from this post. All it is is that you're scared to play deep, alot of these problems sound mental rather than problems with your game

Re: Cash Game Problems
 

Don't you find that waiting for good starting hands just screams 'I'm a tight player' and then people just fold to your raises?

Do you play cash games with less fear of getting stacked than you do tournaments, because I play with a lot more freedom in tourneys, when I imagine the opposite is correct.

Re: Cash Game Problems
 

Once youre stacked in a tourney its over, in a cash game you rebuy. If getting stacked once scares you, your bankroll is not large enuff to move to a lower limit till you find a level of comfort

Re: Cash Game Problems
 

i encounter the same problem. I do quite well in tourneys and sng´s, but in contrast to you i suck in cashgames, what is of course even worse...i have switched between LHE, NL and even Omaha lately, cause of frustration/tilt etc...at the moment i have the feeling that waiting for the nuts is easier in omaha. In microlimit games, i get the feeling, people don´t "respect" or even think about someone making pfr´s. And of course i get the worst out of it. Although this experience is mainly on FTP, haven´t encountered that on other sites before. Reading opponents (hand ranges) seems much more important than i thought. Also people often say that it´s very tough to do that in these limits, cause a lot of people seem to have no clue about what they are actually playing! So they can hold anything. I believe that in tourneys it is much more "accepted" to play mostly topcards only (rebuy etc..)
well, i would appreciate good advice on this topic, too!

Re: Cash Game Problems
 

here's something i wrote for a friend once:


obviously this is a subtle topic, but i'll give you my top 3
adjustments for cash games. I'm comparing with the early stages of a
tournament, when the blinds are small relative to your stack and the
prize money is way off.

1. usually in a cash game you are deeper stacked. this has several
implications: meaningful play often proceeds to the river, which means
playing out of position (OOP) is harder; implied odds preflop and
postflop are more generous so hand-reading becomes more important;
hands with which it would usually be correct to stack off with in a
tournament have to be played with more care.

2. Related to the first point, I quote Barry G: "Bet sizing is a
function of not only the pot size, but of how much you have in your
stack. In tournaments, stacks are typically much shorter relative to
the pot size than in side games, so the bets you make are typically
less than in a side game. For example, a player with a draw will make
less when he hits it against you and get paid off." You need to bet
bigger in cash games to cut the implied odds you are offering later in
the hand. I also quote myself

"In addition to Barry's point, I bet smaller when I'm playing
tournaments because:

- you have greater fold equity in a tournament (because people want to
look after their stack) and
- it is easier to play for stacks vs decent hands (because people are
keen to double up with those hands)
- when I lose chips, I can't top up" (me and barry chat poker:
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showfl...96#Post9988811)

The opposite applies in cash games.

3. Short-stack play in cash games should be tight, not loose
(short-stack about 30 big blinds or less). This is because you don't
have to double up several times before you get blinded out to be in
with a shout of the money: you can win money whenever you get involved
in a hand. You have to be tight, because a) you have very little
implied odds b) you will frequently be pot-committed when you do play
a hand. You can also win money this way because people will frequently
over-estimate their implied odds vs you, and frequently over-estimate
their chances of winning vs your range. You might think it's slightly
odd that I've mentioned how to play a short-stack as one of my top 3
adjustments for cash games, but it's actually quite pertinent.

Firstly, you should see that a shorter stack is not necessarily a
disadvantage, as long as you adjust correctly to it, and can in fact
be very profitable if your opponents don't adjust correctly. Secondly,
it shows the thinking involved in cash games: playing tightly is often
a good way to make money, but also taking advantage of situations
where you have good implied odds is also very important. Finally you
could consider short-stacking: it is lower risk and requires less
skill, but TBH it is pretty dull, you won't learn much about deep
stack poker, and I don't think you need to do it.

So that's the theory. A few quick applications of that:

- play very tight in early position and in the blinds
- look to take advantage of your position in late position, and also
look to take advantage of implied odds type hands in position (they
are much easier to play in position)
- don't build big pots with marginal hands. consider checking single
pairs on dry flops or turns.

also, if you flop a monster draw (say 10+ outs), be very amenable to
getting it all in. this is not only likely to be +EV, but also helps
you get action with your monster made hands.