these AQo spots really annoy me
 

3 awful players limp, and a solid player raises in LP. his range here is KQ+, ATs+, AJo+, 99+. I have AQo on the button. if i 3 bet im 99% sure no one's folding.

do i just fold now and get it over with

Re: these AQo spots really annoy me
 

You can't fold. I'd three bet for value and initiative, keeping in mind that you don't HAVE to c-bet every flop. Also maybe someone folds, you never know. Also, if you were in the SB, I think this would be closer.

Re: these AQo spots really annoy me
 

^^Agreed. If anything getting the blinds out is a good enough reason.

Re: these AQo spots really annoy me
 

3-bet is what you do if he has a wide enough range. Late position raise from a solid TAG will include a lot of suited broadways and suited aces.
Tell me why you don't consider coldcalling and raising a lot of flops.

Re: these AQo spots really annoy me
 

3bet. with that many players in you gain value from calls with crap/dominated cards. also, the solid player won't screw around and cap less than JJ+, AK. maaaybe AQs. so we further define his hand which is good. plus we get to the turn for free alot or we can bet the flop and check the turn UI.

Re: these AQo spots really annoy me
 

WOW-That cynical tone suprises me. It sounds like something that I would say.

If you think that you are probably dominated here then, although weak, a fold may be good.
I don't see why you can't cold call here (SSHE says you can)

What if you hit an A high ragged flop and you see alot of action...
What is our line?

Re: these AQo spots really annoy me
 

*sigh*

I don't like these either. I'm generally three betting in this spot and here's my rationale. BTW, by this spot, I mean limpers and a raise from a not horrible player while I'm in position. I would fold this if the good player was EP or his range was too narrow for playing to be +EP.

-Calling is clearly wrong, and folding is almost certainly -EV
-I do not have to c-bet on the flop
-I'm in position, making it way easier to avoid -EV postflop situations. Conversely, you can exploit the situations when you are likely to be ahead better. You lose less when you're behind and make more when you're ahead.

Re: these AQo spots really annoy me
 

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*sigh*



- Calling is clearly wrong, and folding is almost certainly -EV
I assume you think a call is wrong because you won't be able to access where you are at in the hand on the flop, other than even more behind, or is there another reason?


-I do not have to c-bet on the flop
-I'm in position, making it way easier to avoid -EV postflop situations. Conversely, you can exploit the situations when you are likely to be ahead better. You lose less when you're behind and make more when you're ahead.

[/ QUOTE ]

Re: these AQo spots really annoy me
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
*sigh*



- Calling is clearly wrong, and folding is almost certainly -EV
I assume you think a call is wrong because you won't be able to access where you are at in the hand on the flop, other than even more behind, or is there another reason?


-I do not have to c-bet on the flop
-I'm in position, making it way easier to avoid -EV postflop situations. Conversely, you can exploit the situations when you are likely to be ahead better. You lose less when you're behind and make more when you're ahead.

[/ QUOTE ]

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I think a call is wrong because it doesn't give us a chance to fold out any limpers. I recognize that he says a three bet won't fold them. Why are we assuming that? If his table image is a typical Kit image it should fold out something, right?

I also think it makes the hand is easier to play postflop if we three bet. Postflop, I think it is easier for us to extract more when we're ahead and easier for us to lose less when we're behind.

That and if folding is -EV, then how can raising, on the button, be wrong? That's another thing I should have said before, that my decision here is very position dependent. I would fold this anywhere but the CO or button.

Re: these AQo spots really annoy me
 

3 bet. Given his range chances are your behind (but probably not dominated), and the 3 fish give you a lot of equity not only preflop, but in free cards when you miss and paying you off when you hit.