Re: Debate with friend about how a hand was played
 

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He says he wants to see mathmatical proof that his method was less profitable.

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Impossible since u can always tailor an opp that makes every line into the best possible.

Re: Debate with friend about how a hand was played
 

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In Small Stakes Hold Em, they suggest not raising with any pocket pair's higher than 99's in this position, but you guys are arguing to raise.

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This is because SSHE was written about games very different from the online games of today. Specifically, it's written about very loose-passive small stakes live games, where it's practically unimaginable that there would not be any callers before you in HJ/MP3.

~neurotiq

P.S. we're playing together right now at the same table at FTP. Best of luck! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

EDIT: Remember, also, that SSHE itself says of its preflop recommendations: "These recommendations are not rigid. View them like training wheels for preflop play...An expert who fully understands preflop and postflop concepts will frequently deviate (correctly) from these suggestions (76)."

Re: Debate with friend about how a hand was played
 

We have played together many times [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

What reading materials do you guys suggest to getting a better understanding of these limits and how to beat them? I find SSHE to be a good read and it will no doubt help my casino game more where they are maniacs, but for online I want to get better.

Re: Debate with friend about how a hand was played
 

My friend won't budge. He wants mathmatical proof that slowplaying makes you less money than being aggresive. He even said skew the math in our favor rather than skew it in his favor or make it even cause he feels there is no way raising the turn makes you less money than raising the flop, long term.

Re: Debate with friend about how a hand was played
 

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My friend won't budge. He wants mathmatical proof that slowplaying makes you less money than being aggresive. He even said skew the math in our favor rather than skew it in his favor or make it even cause he feels there is no way raising the turn makes you less money than raising the flop, long term.

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Making a proof is impossible. You can't proof one line is better since you are playing people. Making a reasonable estimation takes too long time. Why can't he give u his calculations, then u can post them?

Re: Debate with friend about how a hand was played
 

Tell him he is right and post his SN on stars here.

WTF, his persistence on this is turning you into an forum troll.

Re: Debate with friend about how a hand was played
 

Cause he is certain he his right and in his mind has no need to make calculations, by his logic sets win more often than getting drawn out on so raising after the bet doubles makes more money. It doesn't matter I don't care anymore, I wanna focus on getting better and winning.

Re: Debate with friend about how a hand was played
 

LOL.. fine

Full Tilt 0.50/1 Hold'em (9 handed) Full Tilt Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Friend is MP3 with 7 of clubs 7 of spades:.
<font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="red">Friend raises</font>, CO calls, <font color="#666666">2 folds</font>, BB calls.

Flop: (6.50 SB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="red">Friend bets</font>, <font color="#CC3333">CO raises</font>, BB calls, <font color="red">Friend 3bets</font>,CO calls, BB calls.

Turn: (7.75 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="red">Friend bets, CO raises</font>, BB calls, Friend calls.

River: (13.75 BB) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(4 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="#CC3333">Friend bets</font>, CO calls, <font color="#CC3333">BB raises, Friend raises</font>, CO calls, BB calls.

Final Pot: 22.75 BB

Proof that playing fast is better .. LDO!

Re: Debate with friend about how a hand was played
 

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It doesn't matter I don't care anymore, I wanna focus on getting better and winning.

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Not a mistake.

Re: Debate with friend about how a hand was played
 

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Cause he is certain he his right and in his mind has no need to make calculations, by his logic sets win more often than getting drawn out on so raising after the bet doubles makes more money. It doesn't matter I don't care anymore, I wanna focus on getting better and winning.

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then your friend is a fish and we have just gotten another insight into how fish think. harsh but true. Heres a hint for your friend....how many times does he get 3bet and capped when he plays sets this way? Compare that to what can happen when you just fastplay and it takes your opponents a while to realise they are beat.....and god forbid you get a few callers who are drawing who are prepared to put in multiple bets....

Fortunately for you you have found 2+2 and stand a fighting chance of getting better at poker. stick around, get better and in a years time you can compare your success at the tables to your friend....

I shudder to ask but is your friend a winning player, mathematically...like as does he even run Pokertracker or have a 100% accurate record? Because there are mathematically winning players who have posted in this thread who actually have a mathematically winning record and they dont play like your friend. maths ftw.

yeah your friend is being a http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/5...ickwallem1.jpg so my comments in this post are for your benefit not his.