Stud low buyin tourney play
 

Two hands against random stud tourney player online. First Hand I don't fold because his board looks very weak. Comments?
Tournament - 7 Card Stud High - Level IX (300/600), Ante 60, Bring-In 90 (converter)

Seat 1: 5,159
Hero: 5,384
Seat 3: 2,933
Seat 4: 9,026
Seat 5: 3,504
Seat 6: 2,490
Seat 7: 11,832
Seat 8: 7,701

3rd Street - (1.60 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___calls___calls
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___raises
Seat 3: xx xx 6[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 4: xx xx 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 5: xx xx 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 6: xx xx 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___brings-in___folds
Seat 7: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___calls___calls
Seat 8: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___calls___calls

4th Street - (5.90 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___checks___calls
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___bets
Seat 7: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___calls
Seat 8: xx xx 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___folds

5th Street - (4.45 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___checks___calls
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___bets
Seat 7: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___folds

6th Street - (6.45 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___checks
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___checks

River - (6.45 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] xx___bets
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___calls

Total pot: (8.45 BB)


Second Hand I fold because I think many players will check flush two streets vs big pair in hope of river call. Comments?

Tournament - 7 Card Stud High - Level IX (300/600), Ante 60, Bring-In 90 (converter)

Seat 1: 3,599
Hero: 8,324
Seat 4: 10,466
Seat 5: 3,264
Seat 6: 2,160
Seat 7: 13,145
Seat 8: 7,071

3rd Street - (1.40 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___calls___calls
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___raises
Seat 4: xx xx 4[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 5: xx xx 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 6: xx xx 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___brings-in___folds
Seat 7: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___folds
Seat 8: xx xx T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___folds

4th Street - (3.70 SB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___calls
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___bets

5th Street - (2.85 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___checks
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]___checks

6th Street - (2.85 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]___checks
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]___checks

River - (2.85 BB)

Seat 1: xx xx J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] xx___bets
Hero: K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]___checks___folds

Total pot: (2.85 BB)

Re: Stud low buyin tourney play
 

First hand is fine, although I probably bet sixth and check behind on the river because I'm a loose cannon. I don't think of boards with three Broadway cards as "very weak" myself.

Second hand, I dunno. He shouldn't be playing a three-flush with two hearts gone, especially with no one in and an Ace behind him, but that doesn't mean that he can't have a flush on fifth. I'd bet myself. I find it somewhat unlikely that someone would check that board on sixth and then bluff the river. I'm usually OK with folding one pair in tiny pots.

Re: Stud low buyin tourney play
 

Hand 1 I dont bet 6th because I bet 5th and he called with a board that screams "I have nothing and I will still see the river". I also think that my 6th street check allows me to pick off more river bluffs.

Hand two I agree I probably should have bet 5th. I was thinking that he would call 5th whether or not he had a flush and I would be facing more bets in a bigger pot.

Re: Stud low buyin tourney play
 

Hand 1 I dont bet 6th because I bet 5th and he called with a board that screams "I have nothing and I will still see the river".


That seems like all the more reason to bet if you ask me

Re: Stud low buyin tourney play
 

The problem is that in a tourney you need to conserve bets because you are not going to have more than 10bb even as a medium to big stack. That fact affects play on 6th and 7th street.

Re: Stud low buyin tourney play
 

I thought that the objective in tournaments was to win chips.

Re: Stud low buyin tourney play
 

Yes. However as many authors have noted over the years, each additional chip gained does not result in an equal gain tournament moneying equity. Sometimes a bet saved on a losing hand is worth more than a bet gained on a winning hand. Given the loose starting hand requirement of players in this game the player could have paired one of his hole cards by 6th, and the fact that I haven't made two pair myself means that my hand is theoretically vulnerable.

Let's take the counter thought for a moment. If villian does not have any pairs on 6th and I bet, he might decide that I really have a pair of Kings or buried. In that instance the villian will fold because his board precludes most decent draws. If I check 6th villian will see it as a sign of weakness in my hand and bet 7th regardless of his holdings. Therefore checking 6th seems to be more useful than betting when villian has air.

Re: Stud low buyin tourney play
 

If i really thought he didnt have a pair id bet 6th and love a fold, and love a call even more. if your read is right and he has no pair i think your far ahead enough to take the risk. also, i think the free card you give on sixth by checking could cause you to lose the whole pot so you could look at it as saving chips by betting out.