commerce 40, weird action vs 2p2er
 

Decent commerce 40/80 game, running 8h.

UTG+1, a passive but not terrible player raises. Earlier he open limped UTG and I Isolation-raised from the button and an observer commented "that guy limped utg! That's like a 3bet! and you still raised!" That's certainly an exaggeration, but he has not been getting out of line with his pfrs.

A 2p2er who I know well and who knows me well CCs on the CO. He's been playing pretty solid for the last 3 hours, is stuck a bit but isn't tilting. He's gotten out of line a couple times (3bet some cheese vs a lag, got caught 3barreling once) but that's it. I call 9[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] in the BB.

Flop: 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 5[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]

I check, utg+1 bets, CO calls. I c/r, utg+1 3bets, CO now calls 2 cold, and I call planning on c/r'ing the turn.

Turn: Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

I check, utg+1 bets, CO now c/r's. Hero ...?

What do we think of how the hand has gone down so far? What's our plan?

Surf

Re: commerce 40, weird action vs 2p2er
 

you messed up the turn action. the CO couldn't have checked raised the turn, he was bet into.

does commerce have a 4 or 5 bet cap? if its 5 not making it 4 on the flop is a sin. if not, i still think capping is best but whatever, mix it up.

3 bet the turn. you have 2nd set, 2nd set is really hard to beat. you have also underrepresented your hand so far.

EDIT: one last thing, literally the only two hands a solid CO could have that beats you is JTs (but not likely clubs) and 7c6c. 76c has to be discounted because he will find a raise the second time around almost always, plus he likely wouldn't call with it preflop. there isn't close to enough evidence based on his betting that he holds one of those particular hands, i really hope you didn't flat call. similarly, UTG+1 could have QQ and thats about it, and he certainly hasn't narrowed his range down that much from his initial raise preflop. not really room for discussion on the turn imo.

Re: commerce 40, weird action vs 2p2er
 

I like a coldcall and donk any river board pair, heart, or club. Basically I think you want only one bet to go in on the river (unless you boat but he will not give you excess action with a straight in this case anyway) and he will have a hard time raising on these river cards whether he has a straight or set and the straight is far more likely.

I check/cry call a brick.

-DeathDonkey

Re: commerce 40, weird action vs 2p2er
 

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What do we think of how the hand has gone down so far?


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I think CO coldcalling preflop is not good.

Re: commerce 40, weird action vs 2p2er
 

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I like a coldcall and donk any river board pair, heart, or club. Basically I think you want only one bet to go in on the river (unless you boat but he will not give you excess action with a straight in this case anyway) and he will have a hard time raising on these river cards whether he has a straight or set and the straight is far more likely.

I check/cry call a brick.

-DeathDonkey

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Re: commerce 40, weird action vs 2p2er
 

If CO is a good player, JTs is about the only hand that makes sense for him. However, his pre-flop cold-call makes me wonder if he really is that good. Either way I'd just call the turn because UTG+1 seems like the kind of player that would get frustrated and call down with a big pair if it's one bet at a time.

I would consider bet/calling any river if I thought CO could be making a fancy play or have misplayed pf and flop. Otherwise what DD says.

Re: commerce 40, weird action vs 2p2er
 

There probably isn't a hand he should have here but if there is one it's 88.

Also just cap the flop and get one more full bet in there. You can still check the turn if you want because of the two clubs but I'd just raise pound pound.

-Michael

Re: commerce 40, weird action vs 2p2er
 

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you messed up the turn action. the CO couldn't have checked raised the turn, he was bet into.


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Sorry about that, I worded it incorrectly. CO obv couldn't c/r in position, he just conventional raised, the action is all correct.

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does commerce have a 4 or 5 bet cap? if its 5 not making it 4 on the flop is a sin. if not, i still think capping is best but whatever, mix it up.


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4bet cap i think multiway, unlimited HU.

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3 bet the turn. you have 2nd set, 2nd set is really hard to beat. you have also underrepresented your hand so far.

EDIT: one last thing, literally the only two hands a solid CO could have that beats you is JTs (but not likely clubs) and 7c6c. 76c has to be discounted because he will find a raise the second time around almost always, plus he likely wouldn't call with it preflop. there isn't close to enough evidence based on his betting that he holds one of those particular hands, i really hope you didn't flat call. similarly, UTG+1 could have QQ and thats about it, and he certainly hasn't narrowed his range down that much from his initial raise preflop. not really room for discussion on the turn imo.

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Right. The plan was to c/r the field on the turn, but the CO's pf CC was certainly confusing, and the turn c/r makes JT look possible but he really shouldn't be CC'ing that pf.

Surf

Re: commerce 40, weird action vs 2p2er
 

i think you have the nuts. he likely has K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].

Re: commerce 40, weird action vs 2p2er
 

When CO cc's pf and then again on the flop, I think you have to cap/4 bet it and then bet/3 bet the turn.

As played, I'm thinking 3 bet the turn. But the truth is being there and knowing the players makes a big difference between calling and raising it.

How would CO play AcQc pf? If UTG is as tight as you say, does he just cc? I'm guessing he'd 3 bet AcKc pf.