lolriver
 

Villian is a tag old regular. Not the greatest player ever, but solid and certainly a winner. He prob views me as a tight moron because every hand I get dealt has a 2 in it and I actually fold to river raises.

FW 20/40

Preflop Hero is bb with K [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
Folded to villain in CO who raises, folded to hero, hero calls

Flop K [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
Hero c/r villain call

Turn 6 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
Hero bet villain call

River A [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
http://www.geocities.com/retroboyil/whammy2.jpg

Re: lolriver
 

If I say check-raise everyone will laugh at me.

Re: lolriver
 

what exactly are we putting him on that this river hit him? QJ/QT/KJ/KT seem his most likely holdings. Personally, I'm open raising any suited king from CO, particularly with a nit like you in the BB (not that I know you from other than your self-description). Fine, I suppose AJ/AT/A9 are possibilities, but.... What I'm asking myself is if I get more value out of betting, or check/calling. The answer depends on the villian, I guess, but you should be betting this river generally. For the most part, if you check here a random player will only bet his winning hands. If you bet, he'll not be raising a lone pair of aces, but may raise two pair, and may bluff raise.

Re: lolriver
 

[ QUOTE ]
If I say check-raise everyone will laugh at me.

[/ QUOTE ]

that is because of our options, it is probably the second worst play.

Re: lolriver
 

open muck being the worst? Or bet/3bet?

Re: lolriver
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If I say check-raise everyone will laugh at me.

[/ QUOTE ]

that is because of our options, it is probably the second worst play.

[/ QUOTE ]

I dont think we have any good options. If we bet he calls with all hands that beat us. If we check he bets all hands that beat us and if he is at all good alot of hands that dont.

I am not saying it will work all that often, but our image should allow folds of some better hands and we also loosen up our own image in the process, which I am all for against this type of opponent. Not making this a standard line. I just dont think it is that bad under the circumstances.

Re: lolriver
 

I think c/f is right even though it sounds gross. Problem is, despite the fact that he views you as tight, this isn't the type of action you normally put in with a hand that you plan on folding. That means he shouldn't be bluffing very often at all; especially because he's old and good. I would say if he bets the river it's likely he's got you. It IS live, after all...

Re: lolriver
 

Actually now that I think about it, I would be surprised if he was capable of turning QJ or QT into a bluff. This a concept that I have copied from the fish. Turning perfectly showdownable hands into bluffs against tight players.

Re: lolriver
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If I say check-raise everyone will laugh at me.

[/ QUOTE ]

that is because of our options, it is probably the second worst play.

[/ QUOTE ]

I dont think we have any good options. If we bet he calls with all hands that beat us. If we check he bets all hands that beat us and if he is at all good alot of hands that dont.

I am not saying it will work all that often, but our image should allow folds of some better hands and we also loosen up our own image in the process, which I am all for against this type of opponent. Not making this a standard line. I just dont think it is that bad under the circumstances.

[/ QUOTE ]

the only hand that will ever fold that we can't beat is KJ.

Re: lolriver
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If I say check-raise everyone will laugh at me.

[/ QUOTE ]

that is because of our options, it is probably the second worst play.

[/ QUOTE ]

I dont think we have any good options. If we bet he calls with all hands that beat us. If we check he bets all hands that beat us and if he is at all good alot of hands that dont.

I am not saying it will work all that often, but our image should allow folds of some better hands and we also loosen up our own image in the process, which I am all for against this type of opponent. Not making this a standard line. I just dont think it is that bad under the circumstances.

[/ QUOTE ]

the only hand that will ever fold that we can't beat is KJ.

[/ QUOTE ]

I dont know would u call a cr by a nit with AT or AJ on this river? I am not saying this is the best play, but I am always on the look out for spots like this so that I can bat them around to see what others think.