600 NL | Tricky KQo OOP in RR pot
 

No reads on villain. 3-bet me once before and I folded. Not sure why I opted for a call here, I probably should have folded pre.


PokerStars Game #9690797303: Hold'em No Limit ($3/$6) - 2007/04/30 - 22:45:49 (ET)
Table 'Albiorix III' 6-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: datrip1 ($716 in chips)
Seat 3: rembones ($194.15 in chips)
Seat 4: rolonrolon ($749.40 in chips)
Seat 5: DanielGChan ($624.70 in chips)
Seat 6: Jill_Brown ($591 in chips)
datrip1: posts small blind $3
rembones: posts big blind $6
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to rolonrolon [Ks Qh]
rolonrolon: raises $15 to $21
JMD13 has returned
DanielGChan: raises $33 to $54
Jill_Brown: folds
datrip1: folds
rembones: folds
rolonrolon: calls $33
*** FLOP *** [9d Qc 5h]
rolonrolon: bets $80
DanielGChan: raises $80 to $160
rolonrolon: calls $80
*** TURN *** [9d Qc 5h] [5s]
rolonrolon: checks
DanielGChan: checks
*** RIVER *** [9d Qc 5h 5s] [Ad]
rolonrolon: checks
DanielGChan: bets $410
rolonrolon: folds
DanielGChan collected $435 from pot
DanielGChan: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $437 | Rake $2
Board [9d Qc 5h 5s Ad]
Seat 1: datrip1 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: rembones (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 4: rolonrolon folded on the River
Seat 5: DanielGChan collected ($435)
Seat 6: Jill_Brown (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)

Re: 600 NL | Tricky KQo OOP in RR pot
 

Fold preflop. Hate hate hate flop lead, c/c and see a turn.

Re: 600 NL | Tricky KQo OOP in RR pot
 

id opt for a fold pre. the weird minraise from him makes me even more uncomfortable postflop.

Re: 600 NL | Tricky KQo OOP in RR pot
 

Flop lead is horrible. Your calls may be ok or at least not as bad, since he is giving you reasonable odds, but preflop is certainly questionable.

Re: 600 NL | Tricky KQo OOP in RR pot
 

fold preflop, don't lead flop.

Re: 600 NL | Tricky KQo OOP in RR pot
 

I check call flop oop probably. Against some opponents pre is fine, othertimes its an easy fold.

Re: 600 NL | Tricky KQo OOP in RR pot
 

[ QUOTE ]
Fold preflop. Hate hate hate flop lead, c/c and see a turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agree 100% with your statement. But assuming he calls preflop and takes your suggested line on the flop and a blank falls on the turn as it did, do you lead turn? Attempt to check-raise turn? Check/call turn? Check-fold turn?

I figure I am either way ahead or way behind on this rainbow board. The only possible drawing hand is JT. If I am ahead he has 2-3 outs. If I am behind, I have 0-5 outs. Out of position, do you try to keep the pot small here and risk giving a free card if the turn goes check-check? Or do you "value bet" the turn? Do you fold if he raises your turn "value bet"? If the turn goes check-check, do you have to check-call any reasonable bet on the river (ie induce a bluff)? Surely you don't donk bet the river after a check-check turn with a hand that only gets called when its beat.

Re: 600 NL | Tricky KQo OOP in RR pot
 

What are the reasons for not leading on the flop?

Re: 600 NL | Tricky KQo OOP in RR pot
 

[ QUOTE ]
What are the reasons for not leading on the flop?

[/ QUOTE ]

Personally, I hate defining my hand out of position on a dry flop against a preflop raiser (who has position on me). I am telegraphing that I have a Q. It's hard enough to play profitably out of position when your hand is disguised.

Re: 600 NL | Tricky KQo OOP in RR pot
 

[ QUOTE ]
What are the reasons for not leading on the flop?

[/ QUOTE ]

1) We build a big pot with a hand we don't like to go broke with.

2) We let him get away cheap with hands we beat that he would otherwise c-bet.

3) Whatever villain chooses to do, it gives us very little information about his hand.

4) We have no idea what to do if he raises us.