2/4 HU Line Check
 

Villain seems like a mediocre TAG. I've been playing with him a little while. My image is probably pretty standard TAGish

FFull Tilt Poker - No Limit Hold'em Cash Game - $2/$4 Blinds - 2 Players - (LegoPoker HH Converter)

<font color="black">Hero (BB): $416.00</font>
SB: $789.00

<font color="black">Preflop:</font> Hero is dealt J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">SB raises to $12.00</font>, Hero calls $8.00

<font color="black">Flop:</font> ($24) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">SB bets $20.00</font>, <font color="red">Hero raises to $65.00</font>, SB calls $45.00

<font color="black">Turn:</font> ($154) 4[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, SB checks

<font color="black">River:</font> ($154) Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 Players)
Hero checks, <font color="red">SB bets $360.00</font>, Hero calls all-in for $339.00
Uncalled bet of $21.00 returned to SB

Pot Size: $832.00 ($0.50 Rake)



My hand is pretty face up here as weak as hell. Thoughts on all streets?

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

turn check for pot control I assume?

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

i pretty much hate all of it

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

i sorta like these thin calls; the problem is u have to be rite...like 65% of the time. HU, people will valueshove obviously thinner than 6max, so I'd say if he's smart enough he's shoving two pair or even something like Qxdd or somethin on this river. It's such a massive overbet it mite be best to fold this. To be honest, I probably woulda bet/called turn in this situation just because rivers will be tough to play. As played, it is probably best to fold especially without any significant history.

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

you overrepped your hand, then you underrepped your hand... then you folded

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

QQ good.

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

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i pretty much hate all of it

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Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

this is not how we play jt here folks hehe

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

i hate the flop c/r if your not going to fire the turn

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

mind boggling

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

can we plz stop saying how bad it is and try to find what would be the best line

lolz

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

betting the turn

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

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i pretty much hate all of it

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dont c/r flop. dont call river.

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

also, saying you are "standard tag" is vvvv vague hu. do you 3bet a lot, do you call a lot oop, is he opening a lot of hands on button, are you c/ring a lot of flops, do you c-bet turn after c/ring flops etc.

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

[ QUOTE ]
also, saying you are "standard tag" is vvvv vague hu. do you 3bet a lot, do you call a lot oop, is he opening a lot of hands on button, are you c/ring a lot of flops, do you c-bet turn after c/ring flops etc.

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the session just started maybe ten minutes ago

i've cr'ed some flops with air, haven't shown down anything crazy, etc.

he seems pretty solid but has made one or two transparent plays that i thought he was just leveling me with but after a short while i came to think he's just not that good

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

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you overrepped your hand, then you underrepped your hand... then you folded

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read. i didnt fold

i mainly want opinions on what to do on the turn. i think i have to call river after my turn play, though maybe i'm wrong here too?

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

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you overrepped your hand, then you underrepped your hand... then you folded

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read. i didnt fold

i mainly want opinions on what to do on the turn. i think i have to call river after my turn play, though maybe i'm wrong here too?

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it's even worse than than when i first looked then. people just don't overbet that often without a big hand. but it's your flop c/r on that board that puts you in an unwinnable spot on later streets

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
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you overrepped your hand, then you underrepped your hand... then you folded

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read. i didnt fold

i mainly want opinions on what to do on the turn. i think i have to call river after my turn play, though maybe i'm wrong here too?

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it's even worse than than when i first looked then. your flop c/r on that board is just atrocious and puts you in an unwinnable spot on later streets

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why is this flop cr so bad? you would rather have complete air or a set/big draw here?

what do you like for a line? check/call flop, check/call turn?

i mean i obviously call this in a standard hand but i do like to have a fairly wide cr range hu. you're telling me if you raise here agaisnt a fairly predictable tagish player you want to just check/fold or bet/fold the turn?

i'm honestly looking for advice here and i'm not really ashamed to admit it. I haven't regularly played in a while and i'm really behind the current flow of the games these days.

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

I would rather a donk bet then a C/R, if he 3bets I just shove. If he calls I'd try to crai on the turn. As played I think a call is pretty thin on the river, but it's not bad. As for the turn I would check here against some players, bet against others (those capable of floating the flop, and those capable of folding a better hand). If the turn went check check I would bet 2/3 pot on the rive.r

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
you overrepped your hand, then you underrepped your hand... then you folded

[/ QUOTE ]

read. i didnt fold

i mainly want opinions on what to do on the turn. i think i have to call river after my turn play, though maybe i'm wrong here too?

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it's even worse than than when i first looked then. your flop c/r on that board is just atrocious and puts you in an unwinnable spot on later streets

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why is this flop cr so bad? you would rather have complete air or a set/big draw here?

what do you like for a line? check/call flop, check/call turn?

i mean i obviously call this in a standard hand but i do like to have a fairly wide cr range hu. you're telling me if you raise here agaisnt a fairly predictable tagish player you want to just check/fold or bet/fold the turn?

i'm honestly looking for advice here and i'm not really ashamed to admit it. I haven't regularly played in a while and i'm really behind the current flow of the games these days.

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it's really as simple as you are building a big pot out of position with a small pot hand

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

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I would rather a donk bet then a C/R, if he 3bets I just shove. If he calls I'd try to crai on the turn. As played I think a call is pretty thin on the river, but it's not bad. As for the turn I would check here against some players, bet against others (those capable of floating the flop, and those capable of folding a better hand). If the turn went check check I would bet 2/3 pot on the rive.r

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why would you bet the river if it goes c/c. do you think he's going to call a flop c/r with a worse hand and then call a river bet? i think that's just crazy

i think this guy was just mediocre enough to call the flop with a draw and check behind hoping to hit it on the river as a standard type of play. i dont think he's calling flop c/r with one pair and betting the turn, etc.

i know i'm getting hammered for this hand right now but i dont see a much better line to take. I hate check calling against guys who aren't that aggressive and i hate leading the flop against somewhat frustrated guys who are itching to play back at me. he's definitely not the type of guy to bet / 3be shove a draw he lead with on the flop after getting raised. i was essentially raising flop for value

after he calls me though, do you seriously want to lead this turn? i just can't see him ever putting any money into the pot in this case when we're ahead...

like i said, i fully admit to being a complete heads-up newbie and i'm looking for any feeback you guys have.

i take it most of you guys are just check/calling this flop then?

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
you overrepped your hand, then you underrepped your hand... then you folded

[/ QUOTE ]

read. i didnt fold

i mainly want opinions on what to do on the turn. i think i have to call river after my turn play, though maybe i'm wrong here too?

[/ QUOTE ]


it's even worse than than when i first looked then. your flop c/r on that board is just atrocious and puts you in an unwinnable spot on later streets

[/ QUOTE ]

why is this flop cr so bad? you would rather have complete air or a set/big draw here?

what do you like for a line? check/call flop, check/call turn?

i mean i obviously call this in a standard hand but i do like to have a fairly wide cr range hu. you're telling me if you raise here agaisnt a fairly predictable tagish player you want to just check/fold or bet/fold the turn?

i'm honestly looking for advice here and i'm not really ashamed to admit it. I haven't regularly played in a while and i'm really behind the current flow of the games these days.

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it's really as simple as you are building a big pot out of position with a small pot hand

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don't i need to do this once in a while with a medium strength hand? or are you only c/ring here with draws/sets/and big pairs?

or maybe i'm just totally overthinking this?

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
you overrepped your hand, then you underrepped your hand... then you folded

[/ QUOTE ]

read. i didnt fold

i mainly want opinions on what to do on the turn. i think i have to call river after my turn play, though maybe i'm wrong here too?

[/ QUOTE ]


it's even worse than than when i first looked then. your flop c/r on that board is just atrocious and puts you in an unwinnable spot on later streets

[/ QUOTE ]

why is this flop cr so bad? you would rather have complete air or a set/big draw here?

what do you like for a line? check/call flop, check/call turn?

i mean i obviously call this in a standard hand but i do like to have a fairly wide cr range hu. you're telling me if you raise here agaisnt a fairly predictable tagish player you want to just check/fold or bet/fold the turn?

i'm honestly looking for advice here and i'm not really ashamed to admit it. I haven't regularly played in a while and i'm really behind the current flow of the games these days.

[/ QUOTE ]


it's really as simple as you are building a big pot out of position with a small pot hand

[/ QUOTE ]

don't i need to do this once in a while with a medium strength hand? or are you only c/ring here with draws/sets/and big pairs?

or maybe i'm just totally overthinking this?

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I'd say you are definately overthinking this. This is only a 2/4 heads up against some random decent player, not a deepstacked highstakes game between 2+2'er.

I agree with the don't cr, don't call river.

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

[ QUOTE ]
it's even worse than than when i first looked then. people just don't overbet that often without a big hand. but it's your flop c/r on that board that puts you in an unwinnable spot on later streets

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i agree. flop c/r makes a +ev flop spot -ev.

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

c/c flop, b/f turn, c/c river assuming no scare cards fall would be my default.

Mediocre tag probably plays all his big hands fast, calls with his draws, sometimes calls with worse made hands, maybe bluffs the river, and probably doesn't value bet thin enough to put you in tough spots.

if bad cards fall, let your heart be your guide, and sometimes turn your hand into a bluff

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

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i pretty much hate all of it

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agreed.

on the flop hero raises to build the pot. on the turn checks behind for pot control. then calls a river AI. very unusual line.

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

woa, thats a weird line.


c/c flop, b/f turn
once u raise the flop b/f turn.

with no reads, as played, fold riv.

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

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My image is probably pretty standard TAGish

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If you are a TAG, why are you playing 6-max? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

aight obviously the flop and turn are nonstandard (read: trainwrecks). just curious what people are putting him on the river though assuming we've butchered the hand up to this point


and thanks for the default line Jim. I need to start having solid standard plays instead of betting and raising on a whim all the time

Re: 2/4 HU Line Check
 

just generally... is there a guide or like some tips in an FAQ for hu or is it all just play/post.... HU seems likea more difficult beast (poker in generally is more complicated as you get shorter handed)

also i've been meaning to ask.. fionnmac.. is ur avatar from the office UK?