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-   -   bottom set and flush draw (http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=552444)

mingusmingus 11-22-2007 07:53 PM

bottom set and flush draw
 
Opponent is 38/12/2.5 over 250 hands.

Pot Limit Omaha Ring game
Blinds: $0.25/$0.50
6 players
Converter

Stack sizes:
UTG: $76.30
UTG+1: $122.15
Hero: $89.10
Button: $50.95
SB: $77.65
BB: $23.05

Pre-flop: (6 players) Hero is CO with 5[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
UTG calls, <font color="#cc0000">UTG+1 raises to $2.25</font>, Hero calls, 3 folds, UTG calls.

Flop: A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($7.5, 3 players)
UTG checks, <font color="#cc0000">UTG+1 bets $7.15</font>, <font color="#cc0000">Hero raises to $28.6</font>, UTG folds, <font color="#cc0000">UTG+1 raises to $92.95</font>, <font color="#cc0000">Hero calls all-in $58.25</font>.
Uncalled bets: $6.1 returned to UTG+1.

Turn: Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($181.2, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $181.2)


River: 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] ($181.2, 1 player + 1 all-in - Main pot: $181.2)


Results:
Final pot: $181.2

I hate that raising folds out everything I beat and lets better hands shove, but I'm not sure about calling down either. All comments appreciated.

TimberBee 11-22-2007 08:15 PM

Re: bottom set and flush draw
 
ugh, I don't see any other way to play it. You can't fold getting more than 2-1 when he pushes, you have a set and a FD! I guess it's fine, but I can see why you don't feel good about it.

If you feel he has a higher set here most of the time, I guess you can fold to the reraise, because he sometimes has higher hearts as well. But I'm not sure...

crashwhips 11-22-2007 10:52 PM

Re: bottom set and flush draw
 
Standard, I'm pretty much always jamming it all in when I flop a set + flush draw. He could have a hand that you are ahead of but has lots of outs (i.e. top two plus straight draw, straight draw + higher flush draw) so you want to get the money in before he can draw out on you or before a scare card can come and kill your action. Also, bare top two will often get it in with you on this flop at these stakes.

skelm 11-22-2007 11:02 PM

Re: bottom set and flush draw
 
How often was UTG+1 raising pre-flop? In most of the games i've played I could see him oversetting you with Aces here enough of the time to make this foldable (Although the game i've been playing in does not see much pre-flop agression unless you have aces with good redraws and I'm quite confidant that would not be the case online).

pete fabrizio 11-23-2007 12:28 AM

Re: bottom set and flush draw
 
[ QUOTE ]
How often was UTG+1 raising pre-flop? In most of the games i've played I could see him oversetting you with Aces here enough of the time to make this foldable (Although the game i've been playing in does not see much pre-flop agression unless you have aces with good redraws and I'm quite confidant that would not be the case online).

[/ QUOTE ]

Ridiculous. Even if he turns two aces face up, folding would be a huge mistake.

RoundTower 11-23-2007 12:29 AM

Re: bottom set and flush draw
 
standard, he is aggressive enough to not always show up with aces here, and when he does you're not in all that bad shape.

wazz 11-23-2007 12:42 AM

Re: bottom set and flush draw
 
'I hate that raising folds out everything I beat'

Not true on boards like this at all. Hand is standard, don't second-guess yourself just because you ran into a bigger hand. He has AT + a draw enough of the time to make this very +EV.

pete fabrizio 11-23-2007 12:50 AM

Re: bottom set and flush draw
 
[ QUOTE ]
ugh, I don't see any other way to play it. You can't fold getting more than 2-1 when he pushes, you have a set and a FD! I guess it's fine, but I can see why you don't feel good about it.

If you feel he has a higher set here most of the time, I guess you can fold to the reraise, because he sometimes has higher hearts as well. But I'm not sure...

[/ QUOTE ]

if he has a higher set, he almost never has hearts with it. and in the miraculous occasion that he does, you can still hit quads or go runner-runner.

blopp 11-23-2007 07:33 AM

Re: bottom set and flush draw
 
[ QUOTE ]
Also, bare top two will often get it in with you on this flop at these stakes.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agreed. He can have alot draws, and you have redraw. Just unlucky. I like flopraise to get utg to fold (bether) draws.


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