Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

Game has been pretty loose preflop, but tight postflop. Standard preflop raise of $25-30 has been getting 2 or even 3 callers, but not many hands are going all the way to the river. I have run up the largest stack at the table by getting horrifically lucky early on, and then from using the stack to buy pots on scary flops, etc. - so far I have not been caught bluffing once, but the clock seems to be ticking...

Dealt J [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 10 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] on button; 2 limpers ahead of me; I limp; SB calls; BB checks.

Flop: 4 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 6 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (Pot $25)

SB (has $250) bets $15; 2 callers. I make it $100 to go.

Question 1: Rate my play to this point in the hand.

SB pretty quickly moves all-in, making it $150 more to me. With $405 in the pot, and $150 to call, I call, figuring that I'm getting the odds for the call.

Question 2: Rate this call.

Question 3: Clearly, I was only getting the right odds on this call due to my money that I had already put into the pot. In other words, if he simply went all in on the flop I would not have had the right odds for the call - does this fact change your estimation of how I played this hand?

Thanks for your help. This happened a few weeks ago and it's been on my mind since.

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

Question 1:

I would not put in a semi-bluff raise against more than one and sometimes 2 opponents for the squeeze effect. With a bettor and 2 callers the chances of having fold equity are zero making it a waste of chips. ESPECIALLY in a limped pot that flops low. Make the call and hope to win a big pot when the flush hits, if the turn betting gets to big and it very well may, you can make a good fold.

Question 2: Insta Call

Questions 3: I think your asking if you should call if he pushes the flop, it really depends on your read of the player, keep in mind your a favorite against a pair lower than 9's.

J

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

My main thinking on the original raise was that I wanted to chase out a higher flush draw, if out there -

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

hand is fine. you will never fold a higher flush draw ever. welcome to live poker!

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

Of course you have an easy call as played.

I prefer flat calling the flop.

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

standard. calling the first time around is fine too

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

No preflop raise from you? SB would have to think about your flop raise or missed this hand if you raised preflop. He could have two pair now, which has you putting in money in a worse spot.

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

I'll be really detailed, just for fun...

Sounds like the basic east coast $2/5 game: limp, call, fold. You should raise PF to $30-40. Any outcome you get here is favorable: 1. a multi-way pot with the best multi-way pot hand there is (JTs) on the button; 2. heads up in position against something marginal (meaning you can safely CB just about any flop); 3. take down the $20 with 0 risk. If you get RR pre, you can dump it at minimal loss or play implied odds and try to crack a big pair for a huge pot (and you have a good hand to do it).

Call flop unless you have a good read on SB. The first position bet at an unraised rag flop usually is strong (read, he wants you to raise). Plus there are a lot of turn cards that can help you: 7, 9, 10 (though it makes another straight), J, and heart.

Also, since you failed to raise PF, your hand is transparent. It looks like overs with a draw. The only hands SB could put you on are A8 and 44, and maybe 6s. Not sure how you play, but I'm guessing you raise PF with 8s in this spot, and also maybe with 6s. So ... when you raise the flop, you're playing your hand face up, and you can be sure he's got at least 2p when he's pushing over you. You have to call for the pot odds, but taking an uber-cheap turn would've been much better.

In answer to your questions:
1. You played weak PF and donked the turn.
2. Instacall, but if you brick out, you kick yourself for putting $250 into an unraised pot (with only $40 dead) against a real hand when you were just on a draw.
3. This is something you should be thinking of BEFORE you say "make it $100." As Doyle says, don't go broke in a nothing pot. You succeeded in pricing yourself in on your draw, but at the end of the day you put $250 into a $600 pot on a J high flush draw. No bueno.

I hope you got there though.

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

thanks for the replies. he had the straight. a heart came on the turn.

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

yea I gamble and call with these pot odds... ~3:1 and good for metagame IMO

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

pushing the flop probably has more fe than $100 in this game

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

LOL

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

what paranoid said
i only play the hand the way you did with nfd, and even then i don't love it

Post deleted by Mat Sklansky
 

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

I def don't like popping the flop. You've got yourself three huckleberries with a good draw and overs (given that he didn't have the str8). Call for the draw and build it when you hit. With three people in this seemingly loose game, you're getting paid. I wouldn't worry too much about a higher FD. Call flop, bet/raise the turn and take it down. NH

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

Preflop - i think a raise on the button with JThh to 20/25 would have been better than a limp...but i know how much everyone like limping in live games

Flop - The hand would have been easier to play if you took the lead preflop, bc if someone bet into you (have to be 40-60$), you would make a standard raise, which would committ yourself anyways...or if it was checked to you, you would make a pot sized bet and be priced into a shove.

I still dont mind how you played the hand as limped, however, i think you would have a lot more fold equity on the flop if you raised preflop

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

raise pre to build the pot with J10s OTB.
As played I hate the flop raise alot, ubless you are nutted with the flush draw or have another draw i hate raising here.
Obv call when he shoves
You are really overrepping your hand on the flop its ok to slow down sometimes and just peel.

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

[ QUOTE ]
thanks for the replies. he had the straight. a heart came on the turn.

[/ QUOTE ]

did you win?

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

Depends totally on if SB is a solid player to lead into the field, or he has Q8 and wants to see what is up. Live you can pretty much eliminate the callers from having anything decent, so it is your read on the SB. If he is a donk, then raise it up. Calling allin is fine there with the pot odds. No the fact that he moved in doesn't change the way you played the hand. If he isn't solid, it is still a +ev play given that he will fold a large majority of the time.

Re: Borgata $2/$5 flush draw semi-bluff
 

yes i won the hand.