Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

Pretty self-explanatory. Those last second timeouts before a game-winning field goal attempt. We see the effect it has had on a couple of games. Shanahan (I think) used it on Janikowski in their game and Kiffin used it on Phil Dawson when the Raiders played the Browns. Most recently, Jauron tried to ice the kicker tonight (or last night actually) against the Cowboys, though it wasn't successful.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

yes

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

I don't think it's unethical, cheap or douchey. However, it should still be banned.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

The teams know it's coming.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

Obviously you can't stop a team from calling a timeout. It's not like they're gonna tell the ref that their intention is to ice the kicker.

Now whether the coach should be able to call a timeout on the sideline half a second before the ball is snapped is another issue (it sucks imo).

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

the new rule yes. the old rule was fine when the defense had to call it. It's pure chickensh*t to let the coach wait until 2 seconds before the ball is snapped. The is no debate on this.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

I'm fine with "icing" the kicker... letting him setup, and calling timeout. It's the doing it so late that he kicks it I dislike.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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the new rule yes. the old rule was fine when the defense had to call it. It's pure chickensh*t to let the coach wait until 2 seconds before the ball is snapped. The is no debate on this.

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What he said.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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yes

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Why? Unless you take away the entire ability for coaches to call timeouts, I don't see why this should be any different.

Say what you want, but I think that its a fine way to make sure the kicker is keeping his head in the game. If he can get rattled by something that simple, then its fine gamesmanship. If it doesn't work, you're out 30 seconds and you still lose/go to OT or whatever.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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I don't think it's unethical, cheap or douchey. However, it should still be banned.

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Because it's lame, and really annoying to watch as a fan.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

They really should just make some kind of rule where the coach can't call a timeout with less than 10 seconds on the play clock during field goal attempts or something. I understand that it's totally within the rules, but it's just so [censored] annoying. I can't wait until the kicker misses the first one and drills the second one on someone.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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I can't wait until the kicker misses the first one and drills the second one on someone.

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God, that will make my day. I hope to God it happens. (not to my team though [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img])

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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I think it's unethical, cheap and douchey. However, it shouldn't still be banned.

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Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

Followup: lots of people have been saying its cheap or lame or douchey, and that's why they want to rule changed. Ok, but given that for the rest of the year we live in a world where this is the rule, do you think there is anything "wrong" with using it, assuming that we believe that doing so confers an advantage? That is, would YOU use this, or would you refrain because it's "wrong"?

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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I don't think it's unethical, cheap or douchey. However, it should still be banned.

[/ QUOTE ]Me too.

Or, just take away the ability for coaches to call timeout. A player/captain on the field should need to signal right before the snap. That way the team with ball knows intent better.

What happens when a kicker misses and they called a timeout then make one? LOL. You know this is coming. Obv the coach would claim he didn't call it too. It'll be dumb.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

No, I like it a lot.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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I don't think it's unethical, cheap or douchey. However, it should still be banned.

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Yep this is exactly how I feel. I think its awesome and I love that coaches do it, but it should definitely be banned because it sucks for the game overall and I'm even more worried about the future ridiculous crap that this could lead to. What happens when the coach has all 3 timeouts left?

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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I think it's unethical, cheap and douchey. However, it can't be banned.

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Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

I don't think it's unethical or cheap, but it definitely IS douchey.

It should be banned.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

You should be able to call a timeout any time before the snap in any situation though. I just think probably best for a player to signal it.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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Followup: lots of people have been saying its cheap or lame or douchey, and that's why they want to rule changed. Ok, but given that for the rest of the year we live in a world where this is the rule, do you think there is anything "wrong" with using it, assuming that we believe that doing so confers an advantage? That is, would YOU use this, or would you refrain because it's "wrong"?

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Any coach who feels it gives an advantage but doesn't use it for the rest of the year should be fired immediately.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

Exactly.

Of course, the thing is, I don't think it confers an advantage, and it's just stupid to watch.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

Every coach should use it. That's not being debated. The fact they are allowed to use it is horrible for the game. The crowds are so loud that no one knows that the kick didn't count for at least 5 seconds of massive celebration. Then to make 80k people go through that anxiety again is total b.s.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

It's douchey when a coach says to the sideline ref "I want a TO right before the snap". The most the league can do is stop that, but I dunno, TO's should be used at any time.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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It's douchey when a coach says to the sideline ref "I want a TO right before the snap". The most the league can do is stop that, but I dunno, TO's should be used at any time.

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take the coaches TO calling privledges away

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

How do we get rid of this act? Is it possible to get rid of it while keeping the coaches time out?

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

It will be banned and known as the Shannon rule. The NFL is known as the No Fun League, so any attempt at this kind of gamesmanship will be banned

It is also the league where smoking dope will get you banned for a year while actually cheating will only get you a fine. Go figure

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

I think they should do away with it. The question is how do you change the rules so it can't be done without other adverse affects.

Simply don't allow the opposition to call timeouts if you are lined up for a fg?

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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Simply don't allow the opposition to call timeouts if you are lined up for a fg?

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That would be terrible for the defense. What if they recognize a fake while on the field? They have a timeout they should be able to use it.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

Who cares?

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

The old way was fine. It was never debated. I bet they just go back to the way it was.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

Thank God someone started this thread.

It's completely ridiculous. Change the rule. Only players on the field can call timeout. Problem solved.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

1. Change the rule that allows the coach to call the TO. Make one of the players do it.

2. Give the refs a judgment call, similar to when a batter tries to step out of the box right as the pitcher begins his motion. If the ref rules that the T.O. was called right as, or only a split-second before, the ball was snapped, he can ignore the T.O. and let the play go.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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Who cares?

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Wait till Tom Coughlin does this to David Akers and he misses second.
I promise you'll care.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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I don't think it's unethical, cheap, douchey or effective. However, it should still be banned.

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I don't understand how giving the kicker a practice shot would hurt him in any way, but results-oriented geniuses have decided that it's good strategy because it worked twice. I can't wait until it backfires on someone, I bet some moran in the media will say that that coach isn't as smart as Mike Shanahan because he called the timeout at the wrong time.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

Maybe if an offense lined up with more than a few seconds left on the play clock they could either

a) get the snap off before the timeout was called
b) get the coach to call a timeout without snapping the ball by the center lifting his head like he normally would

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

I think it's effectiveness comes from the kicker thinking he won the game for a few seconds of celebration. Then he has to regroup, put his gameface back on, and do it again.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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Exactly.

Of course, the thing is, I don't think it confers an advantage, and it's just stupid to watch.

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Ask Lane Kiffin, Mike Shanahan, Romeo Crennel, Sebastian Janikowski, Jason Elam, and Phil Dawson about that.

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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2. Give the refs a judgment call, similar to when a batter tries to step out of the box right as the pitcher begins his motion. If the ref rules that the T.O. was called right as, or only a split-second before, the ball was snapped, he can ignore the T.O. and let the play go.

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Giving that type of power to the refs is probably not the best way to go. It will either be too easy for the ref to mess up and take away a team's ability to call a time out. Or it will be really weak and pointless because a coach can make an excuse for needing the time out(no coach should ever have to explain his time out to a ref before hand)

Re: Should icing the kicker be banned?
 

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Yep this is exactly how I feel. I think its awesome and I love that coaches do it, but it should definitely be banned because it sucks for the game overall and I'm even more worried about the future ridiculous crap that this could lead to. What happens when the coach has all 3 timeouts left?

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You can't call two timeouts in a row.