$555 TP9k in family pot
 

Flop bettor is a major lagzor. The limpers are all loose and bad, yes even for a 555.

PokerStars Tournament, Big Blind is t150 (9 handed) Converter on pregopoker.com

UTG (t1760)
UTG+1 (t1415)
MP1 (t1295)
MP2 (t1410)
MP3 (t625)
CO (t1745)
Button (t2625)
Hero (t1480)
BB (t1145)

Preflop: Hero is in SB with K[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
<font color="gray">UTG folds</font>, UTG+1 calls t150, <font color="gray">MP1 folds</font>, MP2 calls t150, <font color="gray">MP3 folds</font>, <font color="gray">CO folds</font>, Button calls t150, Hero calls t75, BB checks

Flop: (t750) K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (5 players)
Hero checks, BB checks, UTG+1 checks, MP2 checks, <font color="red">Button bets t450</font>, Hero ...

Re: $555 TP9k in family pot
 

I just hate going broke here even given your description. There are people behind you and your hand isnt really good in an all in showdown. Just fold it.

Re: $555 TP9k in family pot
 

DD,

If you believe your hand would be good against the button in an all in showdown here, I would CRAI. This isn't the sort of flop where someone's going to call a CRAI with KJ (even bad players), and while, lord knows, you might wind up having to showdown against 2 flush draws or something like that, I just don't see someone having AK or a set here that often.

If you think you hand is most likely bad against the button's range, and that he won't fold anything, fold, obviously. I guess my point is that I would hardly take the other players in to account at all in this spot.

c

Re: $555 TP9k in family pot
 

agree id never really take the others into account, basically agree with cit all around, i just find that the more aggro button is more likely im going to c/r ai.

Re: $555 TP9k in family pot
 

cit,

Button would really fold KJ getting those odds? Also,
there is about the size of our stack already in the pot, so isn't this a profitable push if button folds a lot (even though we won't be a favorite the very rare times he calls)?

Button is going to be stabbing with so many hands. Stuff like A5/A3/A4, as well as worst Ks and FDs. He has everyone else in the pot well covered so it seems like an easy steal spot when everyone shows weakness on a pretty harmless board.

Re: $555 TP9k in family pot
 

isura,

i meant i don't expect one of the people who checked originally who is now "behind" us to just check call all in with KJ. button could very well call with KJ.

when i said if you think you're ahead against the button i meant +ev against his range, not every time ahead.

Re: $555 TP9k in family pot
 

My guess is that shoving and folding are going to be very close. I probably close my eyes and shove. 22/44/KK and button with a bigger K are really your only fears here.

Re: $555 TP9k in family pot
 

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i meant i don't expect one of the people who checked originally who is now "behind" us to just check call all in with KJ. button could very well call with KJ.


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Okay, makes sense.

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when i said if you think you're ahead against the button i meant +ev against his range, not every time ahead.

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I think we're definitely +EV against his betting range. But not necessarily against his calling range. But I was asking where the latter is even that important if he is so laggy.

Re: $555 TP9k in family pot
 

We're crushed by his calling range obviously. The hope is that it's something like 25% or less (WAG) of his stabbing range.

Re: $555 TP9k in family pot
 

I guess I'd let it go. Even if he's LAG, more often than not he's betting into a pile of players this big with at least top pair, and any top pair he has will very likely beat yours. I'm not limping K9s in the SB here to hit a K high board facing a bet in a 5way pot..

Ryan