Re: 30/60 Limit Game in Toronto with experienced 50/100+ players 4hand
 

Thx for the good advice guys, and you're right I shouldnt be playing, but given that a game with that caliber of players at relaively low stakes comes around so seldom, I was willing to accept a slight -EV situation so that I could sit in a game where I could learn and improve my own game for the future.

And yeah, it was at Blue Heron for who asked... and the game is session fee, not rake.

Thx for the advice guys, I figured that given its 4 handed I couldnt realy let it go at any point, the thing with check-calling or even check-raising the turn like my friend and I were discussing is because the Button would be forced to bet pretty much any hand when checked to given the draw filled nature of the board, and an extra bet might be extracted.

Re: 30/60 Limit Game in Toronto with experienced 50/100+ players 4hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
Thx for the good advice guys, and you're right I shouldnt be playing, but given that a game with that caliber of players at relaively low stakes comes around so seldom, I was willing to accept a slight -EV situation so that I could sit in a game where I could learn and improve my own game for the future.

[/ QUOTE ]

based on the description of the game and the way you played the hand, i would say it's a lot more than slight -EV and you'd be much better off spending that money on coaching or something if the goal is to improve your game.

[ QUOTE ]
Thx for the advice guys, I figured that given its 4 handed I couldnt realy let it go at any point

[/ QUOTE ]

of course you can't let it go, but it has nothing to do with the fact that the game is 4-handed. that's just a flawed way of thinking.


[ QUOTE ]
the thing with check-calling or even check-raising the turn like my friend and I were discussing is because the Button would be forced to bet pretty much any hand when checked to given the draw filled nature of the board, and an extra bet might be extracted.

[/ QUOTE ]

why can't the button be on a draw? giving free cards on this board is pretty disastrous.

Re: 30/60 Limit Game in Toronto with experienced 50/100+ players 4hand
 

why would you ever check this flop? who is the LA player?

Re: 30/60 Limit Game in Toronto with experienced 50/100+ players 4hand
 

By "given that it 4 handed" I mean that the players are playing it accordingly and could be making the same play with a range of hands. (not that "the likelyhood of losing aces 4handed is too unlkely") Folding hands when the odds don't warrant a call has never been a problem for me in live play, short handed or not.

The game selection isn't really my primary concern here, more so I just want to optimize the way I played the hand.


PokerBob, I check-raised the flop to disguise my hand a bit and to figure out where the BB was at in the hand. Also if the button was on any pair I would quite possibly get in 4 bets on the flop as he was playing very aggresively.

His name is Jerry, really nice guy, talks a lot, big guy. Said he's played the 1/2 game at Commerce quite often in the past.

Re: 30/60 Limit Game in Toronto with experienced 50/100+ players 4hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
I check-raised the flop to disguise my hand a bit

[/ QUOTE ]

See your play did the exact opposite of this. After you 3 bet preflop you have whatever range. Most people would basically dark bet the flop so that bet doesn't narrow your range or give your hand away at all. By CRing you are suggesting you have a pair of some sort and are trying to push BB out of the pot. The only thing it disguises is that you would probably be seen as having a smaller pair than you do. But it hardly matters on a 775 board because you are often ahead with any pair and if behind, it doesn't matter how big your pair is if he has 3 sevens.

Jerry = a bald guy who usually wears headphones and does a lot of sports betting? I could be way off...

-DeathDonkey

Re: 30/60 Limit Game in Toronto with experienced 50/100+ players 4hand
 

[ QUOTE ]

PokerBob, I check-raised the flop to disguise my hand a bit and to figure out where the BB was at in the hand. Also if the button was on any pair I would quite possibly get in 4 bets on the flop as he was playing very aggressively.

[/ QUOTE ]

In this spot I don't think it is necessary for you to get cute. You 3bet preflop. They fully expect you to bet that flop, and if they are at all good they are gonna check behind with no-pair hands.

As far as finding out where BB is in the hand, I really don't think it matters. You have two aces. Just bet it.

Re: 30/60 Limit Game in Toronto with experienced 50/100+ players 4hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
By "given that it 4 handed" I mean that the players are playing it accordingly and could be making the same play with a range of hands. (not that "the likelyhood of losing aces 4handed is too unlkely") Folding hands when the odds don't warrant a call has never been a problem for me in live play, short handed or not.

[/ QUOTE ]

how are they playing accordingly? how does their perception of your button opens change given that its 4 handed? are they playing tighter or looser or more aggressive or more passive than they would in a full game? do they assume that you're opening tighter or looser than you would in a full game? are they adjusting properly (by observing how you're adjusting) or do they go by the "conventional wisdom" (which is entirely wrong) that you should play looser in a 4-handed game than in a full game?

Re: 30/60 Limit Game in Toronto with experienced 50/100+ players 4hand
 

wow the game I missed out on, Lol!

Seb85, you need to read Ed Miller's book, twice. Your foundation is way off and you're doing random moves by my calculations.

Checking the flop is fishy as hell, so is checking the turn considering your flop decision

Re: 30/60 Limit Game in Toronto with experienced 50/100+ players 4hand
 

My first thought is find a softer game!!

Re: 30/60 Limit Game in Toronto with experienced 50/100+ players 4hand
 

[ QUOTE ]
Jerry = a bald guy who usually wears headphones and does a lot of sports betting? I could be way off...

-DeathDonkey

[/ QUOTE ]

Just a useles fyi, but headphones aren't allowed in ontario casnios (lame). "Buying the button" isnt allowed, Alcohol/food is expensive and comps suck.

I miss commerce...