Re: observed hand: crazy flop action with bottom set on dry board
 

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FF - this guy

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Very solid SB, who has logged a lot of hands with hero and who is a big winner overall in this game

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does not think like this

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LOTS OF PEOPLE. Typical weak player talk is "every time I raise JJ an ace flops." I am never surprised to find out when somebody limped JJ preflop.


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LA-not only weak players declne to raise JJ from the sb. There are some solid winning players who don't raise JJ from sb after 6 limpers. Also, this guy is also not the only person who could have JJ.

Re: observed hand: crazy flop action with bottom set on dry board
 

i know dude - i have limped jj in the blinds in a full game when it was correct.

anyway, as i said before, your read would have to be INSANE to fold 55 here.

Re: observed hand: crazy flop action with bottom set on dry board
 

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i know dude - i have limped jj in the blinds in a full game when it was correct.

anyway, as i said before, your read would have to be INSANE to fold 55 here.

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I think with 55 here calling>pushing>folding. If I call here w/55 and then MP+1 reraises and CO reraises and solid TAG calls/pushes or CO calls and solid TAG pushes then I could talk myself into a fold

Re: observed hand: crazy flop action with bottom set on dry board
 

Would going broke here be an example of what Sklansky was saying is a leak of many 2+2ers? Er did I completely misinterpret his first post?

Re: observed hand: crazy flop action with bottom set on dry board
 

I think you got the hands wrong and description a little wrong (for your "observed" ahem, hand). I THINK, it was something like this, Hero had 44 UTG, and 6 players to a flop of:
J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]6 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Villain in SB bets $40, hero calls, TAG makes it $120, unknown (poster) makes it $350, Villain calls, and then Hero....

Re: observed hand: crazy flop action with bottom set on dry board
 

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Yeah, this is set > set, but I get all my money in anyway.

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Why? You are allowed to fold sets, especially when there is 18 way action like there is in this hand.

Re: observed hand: crazy flop action with bottom set on dry board
 

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is 55 an easy push?

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Yes, very easy.

Instead of having to worry about 55, we now have 55 and have a hand that we hope to be up against which fits the action perfectly - 33. Furthermore, the only hand that beats us (JJ) is significantly less likely than all the other possible hands.

Re: observed hand: crazy flop action with bottom set on dry board
 

Rotain, I 100% agree 100% with all your ranges of hands, but I think those calculations clearly show this is a fold nonetheless.

I don't understand why people are so unwilling to fold here.

Re: observed hand: crazy flop action with bottom set on dry board
 

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I think you got the hands wrong and description a little wrong (for your "observed" ahem, hand). I THINK, it was something like this, Hero had 44 UTG, and 6 players to a flop of:
J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]4 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]6 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

Villain in SB bets $40, hero calls, TAG makes it $120, unknown (poster) makes it $350, Villain calls, and then Hero....

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I file off the serial numbers sometimes.

I reiterate that I was not in this hand.

Re: observed hand: crazy flop action with bottom set on dry board
 

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Yeah, this is set > set, but I get all my money in anyway.

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Why? You are allowed to fold sets, especially when there is 18 way action like there is in this hand.

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No, you dont understand, I'm not allowed to fold sets. If I do, someone kills a kitten in china or something, and I feel really bad when that happens. So, losing a stack is a little price to pay to saving a life. Plus, I still have some equity. Surely you agree?