Re: Curiosity: How are you guys doing?
 

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Must be me, but I don't get the stop 'n go... if you're going to donk the turn, might as well raise the flop. What will you do against a turn raise btw? Either that, or you can play it in wa/wb fashion, c/c the turn, b/f the river, however with2 pair, obviously it becomes b/c...possibly 3 bet.

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imo the turn donk will get looked up by many hands, including ones w/o an A, whereas a flop CR will cause villian the fold all the hands we beat and call down all the hands that beat us.


that being said i bet the river. your waking up on the turn probably confused the villain and he'll check anything less than two pair on it.

Re: Curiosity: How are you guys doing?
 

At first I thought this was an easy PF fold. Then I saw it was 15/30. And with that structure I think this is obv an easy crud complete.

I actually don't get the flop check. I bet this. Do we raise if the bet comes from LP rather than BB?

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Must be me, but I don't get the stop 'n go... if you're going to donk the turn, might as well raise the flop. What will you do against a turn raise btw? Either that, or you can play it in wa/wb fashion, c/c the turn, b/f the river, however with2 pair, obviously it becomes b/c...possibly 3 bet.

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imo the turn donk will get looked up by many hands, including ones w/o an A, whereas a flop CR will cause villian the fold all the hands we beat and call down all the hands that beat us.

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Yeah that's why I sometimes use the call flop, donk turn move.

I think the river is an easy bet. I donk think we've given the impression we would fold to a bluff. Those times he value bets the river, I don't think he'll pay off the raise enough to make the c-r correct.

Re: Curiosity: How are you guys doing?
 

I'd bet here. You should be good, as BB can't have 86 here b/c he didn't raise the turn, and if he's holding 43 then oh well it's just another BB special. With the weak A, I don't mind c/c'ing the flop at all... very prudent with a drawish board I think.

Re: Curiosity: How are you guys doing?
 

James, I think raising preflop is absolutely maniacal. I can't even believe you'd suggest that. A2o, out of position, in what's going to be at least a 3 way pot against loose players...wow, dude.

Honeybadger, I think your confusion is part of the reason my line works. A lot of the time when someone you think is good does something weird looking there's a tendency to not trust them/think they're trying to outplay you. Combine that with the fact that no one wants to have to come back to 2+2 and read about getting bluffed by another poster, you'll get some calls doing stuff like this that you might not normally get, maybe from something like a 7. Also, if I check raise the flop and he has a draw I might really be screwing myself if he decides to play it aggressively. I think there's a lot to be said for controlling the number of bets that can go into the pot when you're out of position.

Re: Curiosity: How are you guys doing?
 

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James, I think raising preflop is absolutely maniacal. I can't even believe you'd suggest that. A2o, out of position, in what's going to be at least a 3 way pot against loose players...wow, dude.

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lol. i guess my post came across a bit more along the lines of "you should raise this" rather than "i raise lighter pf to get good players out". when i say it should be considered, i think i misstated my intentions. sorry.

IMO, raising with that hand in this spot(especially considering the value we have in implied odds given the cost to complete) is a very poor play.

Re: Curiosity: How are you guys doing?
 

who was the 2p2er, btw? that might change some things depending upon their game/style.

Re: Curiosity: How are you guys doing?
 

It was TheMetetron. I left it out because he hasn't posted in limit forums for a long time. He played well though, I didn't know who he was when I sat down but he was clearly very good. When I found out who he was I wasn't surprised.

Re: Curiosity: How are you guys doing?
 

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Honeybadger, I think your confusion is part of the reason my line works. A lot of the time when someone you think is good does something weird looking there's a tendency to not trust them/think they're trying to outplay you. Combine that with the fact that no one wants to have to come back to 2+2 and read about getting bluffed by another poster, you'll get some calls doing stuff like this that you might not normally get, maybe from something like a 7. Also, if I check raise the flop and he has a draw I might really be screwing myself if he decides to play it aggressively. I think there's a lot to be said for controlling the number of bets that can go into the pot when you're out of position.

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Yes, I can see truth in that; although, if I had been behind you with some pair, I would've raised your turn donk bet, folding to a 3 bet, and planning to check behind the river. Is that bad? What would you have done had this happened?

Re: Curiosity: How are you guys doing?
 

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Honeybadger, I think your confusion is part of the reason my line works. A lot of the time when someone you think is good does something weird looking there's a tendency to not trust them/think they're trying to outplay you. Combine that with the fact that no one wants to have to come back to 2+2 and read about getting bluffed by another poster, you'll get some calls doing stuff like this that you might not normally get, maybe from something like a 7. Also, if I check raise the flop and he has a draw I might really be screwing myself if he decides to play it aggressively. I think there's a lot to be said for controlling the number of bets that can go into the pot when you're out of position.

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Yes, I can see truth in that; although, if I had been behind you with some pair, I would've raised your turn donk bet, folding to a 3 bet, and planning to check behind the river. Is that bad? What would you have done had this happened?

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I would have called a raise. I'm not going to put myself in a spot to fold a showdownable hand here. If I didn't feel I could call a raise I would have checked because the pot is heads up.

I don't think it's a great place to raise with a 5 or 7. If I have an ace I'm calling and I can't really have a worse hand that isn't a draw because I would have folded the flop. Sometimes I'll have a 9 with a draw for a turned 2nd pair, which I'm obviously not folding. If I have a draw with no pair obviously it's a good raise, but I don't think I'd ever play a draw this way because there's too good a chance it's going to end up with a showdown when I'm behind.