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-   -   Dumb question about extracting value (http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=480030)

ddubois 08-17-2007 04:17 PM

Dumb question about extracting value
 
Full Tilt Poker
No Limit Hold'em Cash Game
$5/$10 Blinds
6 Players - (LegoPoker Hand History Converter)

Lucky_Luciano66: $1,156.75
Tigerhans: $1,000.00
Hero: $4,430.75
td8507: $1,000.00
DrObadele: $985.00
PischTheFish: $1,374.00

Preflop: Hero is dealt 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (6 Players)
<font color="red">Hero raises to $35.00</font>, td8507 folds, DrObadele folds, PischTheFish folds, <font color="red">Lucky_Luciano66 raises to $115.00</font>, Tigerhans folds, Hero calls $80.00

Flop: ($240) 5[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (2 Players)
<font color="red">Lucky_Luciano66 bets $190.00</font>

Do you go ~590 and call a shove, or shove ourselves now? Do you ever have reads that would affect your decision one way or another? Does shoving represent a draw better than a half-stack raise?

I'm inlined to shove, but my motivation is the fact that it feels lower variance. Like, winning $430 straight away guaranteed is higher +EV than getting the rest in as a 2:1 favorite, if my math is right. I'm shoving because I want JJ to fold.

mwalsh2020 08-17-2007 04:22 PM

Re: Dumb question about extracting value
 
wtf?

ipokeder 08-17-2007 04:24 PM

Re: Dumb question about extracting value
 
minraise is the most EV

linuxrocks 08-17-2007 04:27 PM

Re: Dumb question about extracting value
 
[ QUOTE ]
I'm shoving because I want JJ to fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

Classic!

mike0292 08-17-2007 04:45 PM

Re: Dumb question about extracting value
 
on a drawy flop like this i just push, on a drier one i would raise small

ddubois 08-17-2007 04:48 PM

Re: Dumb question about extracting value
 
[ QUOTE ]
minraise is the most EV

[/ QUOTE ]
Are you being facetious? Or are you trying to induce AK/AQ to bluff shove?

[ QUOTE ]
wtf?

[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Classic!

[/ QUOTE ]

You guys are mocking me like I'm an idiot or hate money. But please, look at my point, and if my logic is wrong, point out the error. This is a discussion forum, ya know?

Board: 5h 9s 8h
Hand 0: 67.121% 66.36% 00.76% 657 7.50 { 9d8d }
Hand 1: 32.879% 32.12% 00.76% 318 7.50 { JdJh }

$430 &gt; (67% of 1156) - (33% of 1156)

So, unless I screwed up and that's not the right way to look at the situation/math, I appear make a tiny bit more money when JJ folds than when we get all-in. Moreover, it's lower variance. The math is roughly the same with flush draws, so I think I do better when they fold than gambling it up. (Admittedly, JhJd is a bit skewed having two backdoors. I climb to 73% equity against black aces, but they call anyway, so it doesn't matter.)

KitanaiCALL 08-17-2007 05:03 PM

Re: Dumb question about extracting value
 
let me get this straight. we're putting villain on a med pp+, Aqo+ pretty much right? would be it be higher variance play to call flop and try to get an extra bet from this guy on the turn, of course getting it all in at this point once he is more committed to the pot (assuming that the board doesn't pair underneath)? How would villain think we play A9 against him in this spot?

Victor 08-17-2007 05:05 PM

Re: Dumb question about extracting value
 
i think pushing gets you looked up by any overpair due to the combo draw possibility.

Praetor 08-17-2007 05:09 PM

Re: Dumb question about extracting value
 
hes not folding an OP

jalexand42 08-17-2007 06:13 PM

Re: Dumb question about extracting value
 
[ QUOTE ]
I'm inlined to shove, but my motivation is the fact that it feels lower variance. Like, winning $430 straight away guaranteed is higher +EV than getting the rest in as a 2:1 favorite, if my math is right. I'm shoving because I want JJ to fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

w. t. f.


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