Two Plus Two Newer Archives

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- Small Stakes (http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/forumdisplay.php?f=41)

- - JJ standard? (http://archives1.twoplustwo.com/showthread.php?t=557257)

PartyPoker $200 NL Hold'em (6 handed) HandRecorder v0.9b

Stacks & Stats
SB ($248.66)
BB ($277.80) (45/33/6.87/28) (40h)
UTG ($112.30)
CO ($114.60) (50/25/4.06/33) (16h)
MP ($98)
Hero ($216.50)

Preflop: Hero is BU with J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]
UTG calls $2, 1 folds, CO raises to $9, Hero raises to $32, 1 folds, BB raises to $55, 2 folds, Hero calls $23.

Flop: ($122) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB checks, Hero checks.

Turn: ($122) 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets $26, Hero calls $26.

River: ($174) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
BB bets $78, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $252.

Re: JJ standard?

push pre or fold pre imo
any reads? has BB shown down good hands? has he been a spaz? 40 hands is nothing. I fold pre without a read.

Re: JJ standard?

prolly just stick it in pre vs this retard

Re: JJ standard?

[ QUOTE ]
prolly just stick it in pre vs this retard

[/ QUOTE ]
have you ever raised 13 out of 40 hands? I know I have. This is where a read would be very helpful

Re: JJ standard?

I'm shoving so fast pre against a 45/33. The min cold 4-bet reinforces the fact he's probably terrible.

Re: JJ standard?

[ QUOTE ]
I'm shoving so fast pre against a 45/33. The min cold 4-bet reinforces the fact he's probably terrible.

[/ QUOTE ]

but a min 4 bet is exactally what "terrible" players do with AA KK QQ

Re: JJ standard?

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
prolly just stick it in pre vs this retard

[/ QUOTE ]
have you ever raised 13 out of 40 hands? I know I have. This is where a read would be very helpful

[/ QUOTE ]

God this is the most retarded [censored] argument, and it shows up in this forum almost every single day. The point, as always is that the mean of all samples is the true mean. Yes, you only have 40 hands. Yes, it's a relatively small sample - but if you take all the 40 hand samples you have of players where they run 45/33, the vast majority of those players would be much closer to 45/33 in reality than they would be to 23/20, for example.

Put another way. If you play a 23/20 game, for example - and take 100 random 40 hand samples of your play. The average of all those samples is going to be extremely close to 23/20. Similarly, the vast majority of those samples will be relatively close to 23/20. You'll probably have a 15/12 here, and a 50/40 there - but they will be rare outliers - rather uncommon. Especially when sampling something like VPIP which converges very quickly.

There is no perfect information. You have a sample that is more likely to be close to reality than not. You can choose to ignore if you want. But it is not invalid by any means.

Re: JJ standard?

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I'm shoving so fast pre against a 45/33. The min cold 4-bet reinforces the fact he's probably terrible.

[/ QUOTE ]

but a min 4 bet is exactally what "terrible" players do with AA KK QQ

[/ QUOTE ]

He is terrible and mad aggro. Of course he could have AA/KK/QQ here. He could also have a [censored] ton of other random crap as well.

Re: JJ standard?

what dire said along with the fact that if I had raised 13 out of my last 40 hands and some taggy guy three bet me, I'd be willing to get it in pretty light knowing that he's often just paying attention and playing back at me.

oh, also, once he min four bets we go from no reads to 45/33 retarded donkey guy.

Re: JJ standard?

I agree with cheer, over 40 hands I don't think we can assume the stats are accurate. And against virtually any type of player, I don't think shoving JJ over a min 4 bet is +EV, as he said that's usually QQ+.
Villain does look like a retard though given his postflop line [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]