Screwplayed. Muck it?
 

I don't know the villain here much. He's been around for a couple of orbits, seems to have TAGish tendencies and hasn't turned up with any out of line hands yet.

Online $10/20 four handed. I open AJo UTG, folded to villain in SB who threebets. BB gets out of the way and I call.

Flop is AQ4 rainbow. He bets and I call.

Turn is 9. He checks, I bet, he raises.

In play I just called this down without a second thought... but on second thought, could we consider mucking this? We don't have to do it, but should we consider it?

Re: Screwplayed. Muck it?
 

I consider folding here but damned if I do 4handed.

Re: Screwplayed. Muck it?
 

I'd call down, fully expecting to see AA, AK, AQ, QQ, 99, and hating myself for paying off.

Given your read, you're probably crushed. I've been a victim of this play many times and have also been the victimizer. Villain deceives you into thinking he doesn't like the Ace and then slams you with a checkraise, and by the river's end, you're staring at top-two or a set.

Still, even for meta-game, I think we need to pay off. There's also the possibility he holds something like JJ, TT, 88, reads you for a weak-ace or something like KQ, and is using the Ace as a scare card to try and power you off such a hand.

Also, should we consider checking behind on the turn? Much like the example in "The Theory of Poker" where we have AA on a KKx board, and Sklansky advises to just call down.

The board is non-threatening, it's heads-up, and a good player has just suspiciously checked after showing a lot of pre-flop strength. That usually signals a monster (or nothing). I think KK, KQ, JJ, TT, continues to bet since you didn't raise on the flop, and even with the above hands, he's still ahead of a TAGs standard opening, 4 handed range.

Re: Screwplayed. Muck it?
 

Does anyone cap preflop here?

Re: Screwplayed. Muck it?
 

[ QUOTE ]

Also, should we consider checking behind on the turn? Much like the example in "The Theory of Poker" where we have AA on a KKx board, and Sklansky advises to just call down.


[/ QUOTE ]

I considered it but since we're four handed I think his range contains a lot of smaller aces and pocket pairs that are going to call down so betting is good. If he'd threebet from the big blind rather than the small blind this might change a little but I think a bet is still has plenty of value here.

Re: Screwplayed. Muck it?
 

I take this line all the time and if it was me at most you have 3 outs, and that's only if I'm running hot and have AK. you're usually drawing dead against me though.

he knows what you have and he doesn't expect a fold. but do what makes you feel good.

Re: Screwplayed. Muck it?
 

[ QUOTE ]
but do what makes you feel good.

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Your post seems to say "easy fold" and then you write this...

Any more to it or is it an easy fold?

Re: Screwplayed. Muck it?
 

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
but do what makes you feel good.

[/ QUOTE ]

Your post seems to say "easy fold" and then you write this...

Any more to it or is it an easy fold?

[/ QUOTE ]

I said against me it's an easy fold.

do what makes you feel good means it probably doesn't matter a ton what you do here because you have no read and it doesn't come up a lot. the pot is pretty big, only two more bets to show down, people are stupid sometimes. do you see this line a lot in your game? I don't see it in the stars 10/20 that often. this post isn't about hand ranges it's about moron ranges.

Re: Screwplayed. Muck it?
 

Also, I think, if we don't have a clue what his c/r means, calling down and taking a note will be very +EV in the future, especially if he's a regular; definitely enough to offset a potentially -EV situation.

Re: Screwplayed. Muck it?
 

[ QUOTE ]
Also, I think, if we don't have a clue what his c/r means, calling down and taking a note will be very +EV in the future, especially if he's a regular; definitely enough to offset a potentially -EV situation.

[/ QUOTE ]

also if you call down and you were crushed it's time to start mixing in some turn value checks against this guy.